A vent - Brad's papa
Brad's papa has a habit of telling Brad that he will do something with him before he goes back to NOLA and then doesn't follow through. Every single time he visits he'll say stuff like: "Yeah, we can have dinner! I just need to run a few errands and I should be finished by 3PM." So by the time he calls his dad at 5 PM Brad's a bit shocked to find out his dad isn't finished yet. Brad calls again at 7... then at 9PM and his father was agrivated because he kept calling (omg... 3 times old man) and said "I'll call you when I'm finished!" 10:30 rolls around and he appologizes that he was unable to make it. Brad only says, "It's ok." Ugh. I know it's not ok.
The last time his father was in town I distracted Brad by telling him "Hey! Let's go to Savannah!" when his father wanted to eat lunch with him. His father said something along the lines of "I can have lunch with you if we eat before 12:00." It was 12:15 and I already knew where it was going - he's only done this every single time.  Instead of telling Brad "No, we're still waiting around - but we cannot eat with you. Sorry." He leads Brad on by saying, sure maybe we can do it.  I dragged Brad out that day so Brad was the one calling his dad and canceling a dinner date.
I dislike the fact that Brad cares so much, sometimes I think it would be better if he hated his dad (maybe not hate but dislike his dad). My uncle hated his dad for a long time because he abandoned him. It gave him drive and he did the things he needed to do to push past it. He didn't dwell on his dad or let it ruin his life. When his father was willing to admit he was wrong (and meant it) my uncle forgave him. Brad still wants to be accepted and will take anything his father dishes out and hurts silently. Brad's father says "sorry" more than anyone - but in order for it to work he'll actually have to mean it. I don't think he does - because he does the same thing over and over again like a bad habit. I was unable to save him yesterday, and it upset me a bit. He really had a lot of issues (and still does) because of his dad. When he was young his father pretty much left him and his sister and married a new wife and was outta their lives. He didn't even give them the option of living with him. Brad sort of blurted, "If it were my brother - he would've made the time to meet us!" He shut up right after that. I felt so bad for him. 
Of course, both of his parents are this way, not just his dad. They have both royally messed him up and it really makes me sad that they treat him the way they do. I think all these years he's just stuffed it all inside, hid it and smiled. He still does. He thinks it's normal for familes to act that way. It makes me glad to have the parents that I do. They aren't perfect, but they aren't Brad's parents. |
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| I am right there with Brad, my familiy thinks that i am so independent and mature and that they don't need to do anything for me or my younger brother and sister. I am only independent and mature b/c i gave up on them before i was 10 years old, i quickly saw that they could not be the parents i needed and closed my self off to them. While this has caused pain for me, i believe that is ultimitley healthier for me. I don't like feeling like loving me is just "a duty", i think it should be constant and with out strings. But if Brad can't see how disrespectful his mother and father treat him now, i don't know if he wants to see it. It is definitly heartbreaking to watch someone you love have to be hurt like that.
My thought are with you two 
Shannon |
| Not sure what to say other than Brad isn't alone in his situation with his parents. It is hard to not get upset when parents "string" you along. For whatever reason, we yearn after that carrot they are dangling and we keep striving to earn their love despite how many times they disappoint us. Your conversations with Brad about the situation will hopefully help become more aware of his relationship with his parents. Continue to support him as you are...it will make him feel somewhat better. There's really nothing you can do to eliminate the situation. It's unfortunate that there are parents out there who really should have evaluated their capacity to be "good" parents before having children [/b] |
| You are so right Shannon - he really doesn't want to see it.
His mother called him basically worthless, not worth her time, ungreatful etc etc... some stuff I couldn't believe a mother would say to her child. He spent the whole day just clamed up about it. He didn't say a THING! I finally had to drag it out of him... and then he said "Well, it doesn't happen that often..." He doesn't understand that a mother saying those things ONCE to her child is too often.
I try to get him to talk about it without bringing too much up (so he can vent if he likes). If I ask about it sometimes he gets defensive and will actually defend the very woman who called him a worthless waste of space.  He'll sort of lash back by saying something about my mother and her short commings or whatever. (As if they compare!)
You know how you watch interviews with abused spouses? They will defend their husband/wife tooth and nail. "Oh, but he doesn't beat me near death as often as he used to!" or "She only slaps me around a little - and usually I'm just mouthing off." That's what it's like talking to him about it sometimes. It's actually a miricle that he sounded indignant yesterday about his father. It's like he's not supposed to feel that way or something. He is so mentally abused it's disheatening.
I actually had to tell him a few months ago (very loudly) that it wasn't ok, that it wasn't his fault and he should stop taking the blame for everything. His mother had no right to do this! His father had no right to do that! His sister and brother get in on the action too. His older brother is his father's favorite and his sister is his mother's favorite. He sort of has the middle child mentality - only it's more pronounced since his family treats him like dirt. His brother blames him for stealing things or doing things that he has done himself. They found Brad at fault once for his SISTER locking the keys in the car... like he was supposed to watch her or something? They are friggin' twins! They were 21 years old at the time! Jeeze! I couldn't believe Brad was the one getting yelled at. But back to Brad's papa - I think from now on - if he and his dad are making plans - I'll try to make counter-plans or make his dad give us a specific time to meet up with us. If he doesn't meet us then forget it and we'll do our own thing. There's nothing worse than being bored at the house after your dad ditches you. It gives Brad time to think about it rather than having fun. I think we'll try to pick up early dinners with his dad. If he can't meet us by 6:30 then I'll just make something or we can go out ourselves. 
Edit: He is getting better though. He's starting to not get so defensive and he is slowly starting to talk about it. It might have a lot to do with moving out. I think since he's not dependant on them anymore for shelter and such... he doesn't have to feel greatful for the scraps they throw. I think once all of his things are out of his mother's house he'll feel like he can say what he wants without feeling bad. |
| I'm not sure that I'd actively counter-plan against his family. It might wind up with the rest of his family, and maybe him, resenting you for it.
Tread lightly where family is concerned! |
| Jason's dad is the same way. His mom and dad divorced when he was about 13-14. His dad was active in his life for the most part, until he remarried. Since he remarried, Jason was 16, he only talks to his dad maybe twice a year. We see them maybe once a year at Christmas, if they can fit us in. It's sad because we go see his mom every couple of months, his dad lives about 30-40 mins farther away, and we never see him. The boys don't even know he's their grandfather - they think Kenny (Jason's step-dad) is their grandfather. They call Kenny "Grandpa" and call Mark "Sir" because they don't know who he is.
Jason tries to keep somewhat of a relationship with him - he e-mails them pics of the boys on occasion, he calls his dad every couple of weeks. They read the e-mails but don't respond (he has his e-mail set up where he can see if the person recieved it). When he calls, his stepmom says she'll have him call back but he never does. So after trying for years, Jason has finally given up on his dad. He has started referring to Kenny as his dad. He didn't even call his real dad on Father's day this year - that's when I knew he was tired of trying with Mark. |
Ron wrote: I'm not sure that I'd actively counter-plan against his family. It might wind up with the rest of his family, and maybe him, resenting you for it.
Tread lightly where family is concerned! I think I used the wrong words. I meant that I would have something to do just in case they chose to bail on us. And believe me - his family resents the fact that I met him, dated him, married him and moved away with him. Abusers hate it when you remove their punching bag. They've treated me like dirt anyway - so they can resent me all they want - it'll be be just like old times. I think they just started being a little nicer to me - sort of like when they are with Brad - then go for the jugular.  I'll try to avoid him disliking me though. 
--- I can always tell when his family is about to disapoint him... With his father - it's errands. With his mother - it's sickness or someone is upset. Those two always seem to spout key words that tip me off right away. His dad: "I just have 2 more things to do!" He only had 4 very simple things to do and he's still doing "something" unless it takes 4 hours to locate a toothbrush in a publix that is... His mother: "My head hurts a little - but if I feel better by 5 PM then we can go." She usually sets a time - usually the time is getting pretty late though. Then when we call her at 5 she wants 2 more hours. By then it's too late to do anything - then she says "Oh, well - I still feel bad - sorry." There was of course the time I wasn't allowed to go with her and the family on a trip because Brad's sister "Was feeling bad." Which traslated into "She didn't want to deal with me." They went on the trip - leaving me at the last second - ready to go somewhere. My whole family just left to go somewhere fun and I was waiting on his family (jerks) to pick me up.
I'm thinking that we'll set our own time - I'll talk to him before this of course and even say the same thing will go with my parents. We don't have to worry about them though - they aren't usually late and/or make-up a bunch of garbage to get outta going somewhere fun. If they don't want to go they'll say it. Not string you along all day long.
I'm just tired of waiting around. It's getting irritating. I'm thinking Brad is starting to feel the same way. |
| One option is to set a time and place for dinner. If they don't show...wait awhile (30 minutes) and order. Eat and if they eventually show tell them you got too hungry. Otherwise...at least you and Brad had a nice dinner.
Or plan a trip to the park/movies/amusement park/etc...and plan to meet there. If they don't show too bad, but at least you guys are making the effort to invite them places. Make sure to set it up so that you can still enjoy yourselves even if they don't show or can't make it. Never set it so they pick you up...otherwise it sounds like you will be waiting until the end of time. |
| Sorry you guys are going through that. I wouldn't make any plans with them if this is a normal occurrence. Sounds like they use that as a way to control. I would stop trying to meet up with them period. Even though your husband suffers silently that would concern me because that could cause health problems or problems that surface when you have children and he may inadvertently relive certain learned behaviors. Either that or will be just the opposite because of the bad things that happened to him.
Sounds like he's lucky to have you because you are pretty aware of what's going on and can help him. |
| Huh - you've brought up some good points. We usually wait on them because they are supposed to pick us up. When we're supposed to go somewhere with someone I'll request we take our own car.
I think Brad sometimes liked to save on gas and stuff - but we have a Scion Xa right now - and it gets great gas milage. That would be much simpler!  That way we can leave earlier if we want and then we can meet with them somewhere. We could also get our own food when we wanted to - rather than having to wait for the others to get hungry and whatnot. |
Las Vegas Sheepie Lover wrote: Even though your husband suffers silently that would concern me because that could cause health problems or problems that surface when you have children and he may inadvertently relive certain learned behaviors. Either that or will be just the opposite because of the bad things that happened to him.
I've actually worried about that quite a bit. He used to say some pretty nasty things to me before when he got frustraited. I just sorta have to stare at him when he made comments like he did - because I could hear his mother talking. He would make these hurtful statements just out of the blue - and they had nothing to do with the situation. I think he believed that they were normal in a way.
He would be upset that day - and rather than just telling me what had happened and venting he would start attacking me. He'd say things about me "finding someone else" or "not doing this" or "I'm a that..." I think the worst he's ever treated me was before our wedding - and that's because his beautiful family just heaped on the insults and abuse on him every single day until he just snapped at me continually.
When his mother is stressed out (which is usually about everything) she'll come home and take it out on Brad. She did this fairly early in our relationship so I knew where he was getting it from. She prefers the public humiliation route.
After what I described as the "car ride from hell..." where his mother called him a worthless son, piece of meep meep... because he said she was being negative about every single job he applied to. She discouraged him from leaving his $8.50 job - the one he could never hope to live with me on. She just tore into him. He said it was ok because she didn't do it often. I told him that it wasn't ok that she didn't do it often... because what she was doing to him he was doing to me. He sorta stared at me bug-eyed for a bit and I think he really took it to heart. We get into fights still - but he's never said anything like his mother would since then. He's also has been talking to me more about things that bother him - so he's actually made some (ok - a ton) of progress. I'm gradually making him aware of what's going on through his actions with me. I think sometimes he thinks these problems are ok - until he realizes that he is doing the same thing to do me. Then he cannot deny the problem anymore. I still worry about the kids though if we ever have any - I still need to scrape some more of that gunk his family has done to him. He's still not out of it all the way yet... but I'm holding out hope. I hope you guys don't mind if I vent/rant about him/his family sometimes hehe. Sometimes it's hard trying to reform someone who thinks his lot in life is to be other people's door mat and punching bag. It gets frustraiting. There are also very few people I really want to talk to about his and our problems (especially people who know him). I want to help him and I don't want our friends to think he's a jerk in the mean time.
Brad is a nice man though. He can be aggrivating a times with his made-up words, messed up equilibrium and the way he tries to tickle me at any given moment during the day... but he is really sweet. He is also the man who will rub my feet whenever I ask him, spoils me and works his buns off 12 hours a day just so we have a roof over our heads. I hope that soon he can feel good about himself and realize that what his family has is not normal... or at least not very healthy. I also hope that one day he'll be able to actually feel resentment for the way he has been treated rather than believing he brought it on himself. I think in a few years after he's moved away from his family he'll have changed enough to actually have children. I think he'll probably be the opposite of the way his parents were to him - he'll probably smother them. He knows I would lay the smack-down on him if he ever did half the things his parents did to him. |
| Good luck Integra! I don't have a lot of advice to offer,as i've never had to deal with issues like that... but don't be afraid to get a professional in to help you if you ever feel like you and he need the help. That is a lot of emotional scarring to try to work through and esp if you have children, a professional may really be able to assist you guys above and beyond what you two can do yourselves
Otherwise you rant away girl! I'm here with a listening ear |
| I second that, if you are in a community that has colleges, they will have a program for the (i don't know what you'd call it exactly) but like pysch majors Where the students will be going into clinical study and this helps them get their feet wet with supervision.
I know what your thinking "students, how will a person our own age help at all!!" But i went to a college here in Abilene, not the one i went to, for about a year for issues that i had with my parents. It was ony about once a week or two, but it was so great. I got to talk to a wonderful person, she really helped me tremendously. She is actually graduating in a couple of weeks. If i wanted to continue she would have set me up with another person, but i felt very able to "live with the tools she gave me". And to be very honest, my relationships with my family have neer been better. Oh i forgot to mention the best part. if they are not free, then it will be on a sliding scale. I only paid $4.50 for two hours. and 2.50 for 1 hour. But it seems like you have it pretty much handled. But counsleing may not be a bad idea, It will help both of you communicate better with each other and with family. And it also deepens the bond that you have, b/c you are both working on making yourselves heathlier 
Shannon |
Integra Hellsing wrote: I think once all of his things are out of his mother's house he'll feel like he can say what he wants without feeling bad.
What's the delay on moving out of his mother's house? Just remember, you can't "reform" him. He has to want to change his relationships with his family. Sometimes all you can do is step back and watch the dysfunction. I know it's hard - my husband's family is a mess. But you can't fix them, you can only manage yourself and show him what a warm, loving, supportive relationship is REALLY like! The suggestions about counseling are good ones, sometimes it's easier to talk to an unbiased "expert" than it is to talk to family or friends. It might really help you guys. |
Bailey's Mom wrote: Integra Hellsing wrote: I think once all of his things are out of his mother's house he'll feel like he can say what he wants without feeling bad. What's the delay on moving out of his mother's house? The delay has been us not getting much/any help with our move and having to do everything by ourselves in a small car/small truck. We've almost got everything out of my house now. He just needs to go over there - get his various collections and pick up more of his clothes and we'll be finished there. It's been a bit slow to say the least. I'm sure once our stuff is in one house the move will be much easier next time. I'm not complaining about how slow the move has been though - it's kinda nice in it's own way. We're really evaluating what we need and what we need to get rid of before we take it back to our house. It's also nice because we are being careful with our things. My brother has a tendency to drop very heavy, expensive things on the ground when he gets flustered with moving. |
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