Rammstein's Amerika (America)-How the world sees us.

There is a very heavy rock band in Germany called "RAMMSTEIN." I'd like to provide access to one of their music videos, and then foster a little discussion abotu it, if anyone wants to join in. Don't worry, I've viewed this video and I believe it to be quite family safe.

First the video, then I'll provide translated lyrics.

This video is very large. If you have a dial-up connection, I'm not sure you'll be successful playing this.

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Here are the lyrics, translated to English where necessary.

NOTE: Song lyrics that are in BOLD have been translated, the rest are the original.
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AMERIKA - AMERICA

Refrain:
We're all living in America,
America is wunderbar. (Wonderful)
We're all living in America,
Amerika, Amerika.

When I'm dancing, I want to lead,
even if you all are spinning alone,
let's exercise a little control.
I'll show you how it's done right.
We form a nice round (circle),
freedom is playing on all the fiddles,
music is coming out of the White House,
and near Paris stands Mickey Mouse.

We're all living in America...

I know steps that are very useful,
and I'll protect you from missteps,
and anyone who doesn't want to dance in the end,
just doesn't know that he has to dance!
We form a nice round (circle),
I'll show you the right direction,
to Africa goes Santa Claus,
and near Paris stands Mickey Mouse.

We're all living in America,
America is wunderbar.
We're all living in America,
Amerika, Amerika.
We're all living in America,
Coca-Cola, Wonderbra,
We're all living in America,
Amerika, Amerika.

This is not a love song,
this is not a love song.
I don't sing my mother tongue,
No, this is not a love song.

We're all living in America,
Amerika is wunderbar.
We're all living in America,
Amerika, Amerika.
We're all living in America,
Coca-Cola, sometimes WAR,
We're all living in America,
Amerika, Amerika.
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OK, discussion?
I couldn't help thinking the whole way through that the world has mixed emotions about America, they like our culture, but hate our culture; they are grateful (when they think about it) for our world interventions, but they hate us for our world interventions, especially if we use our dominant position and "act like a bully" by doing whatever we want to do.

The other thing I kept thinking was I'd love to do a rebuttal video, showing how much America is becoming like the rest of the world; While they showed poor areas in Africa, I'd show poor inner city areas, and the devastation of Katrina; Where they showed lots of cultures being "infected" with American products and culture, I'd show Americans celebrating their ancestor's culture. The neat thing about my rebuttal video -- I wouldn't have to change the refrain at all, which seems like it was about 90% of what was sung.

I'd prefer not to go into the "how bad it is that America has all these immigrants and is becoming the rest of the world", I'd like to discuss that from a positive viewpoint in this thread. We've talked about the opposite in a number of other discussions.

So.... Whattaya think?

Just Food for Thought.

Respond to this topic here on forum.oes.org

Lol. Have you ever heard other Rammsteins's songs? They're an industrial club band and they're really in no place to make any social commentary! Du Hast (or I Hate) is all in German and was a big dance song in industrial clubs a few years ago. Even in German the lyrics didn't say much and sure don't make any real social statements. The German songs when translated into English are also very sad-- one song that they have is all about a frog.

These are just some guys playing into similar complaints about America from people that can think on their own and, to be honest, I think lack any real substance or feeling on their own parts. I'd also like to point out that they loved America just fine when their music was being played here. I saw them in concert and they attested to how much they loved being here-- unless they were lying to the crowd and I know they wouldn't do that...

You can dance to it though.

My fiance loves them, even though their lyrics can be a bit anti american or really anything that they disapprove of. He basicaly just likes the way they sound, in german or whatever language they are "singing" in :wink:

They don't really make a stand on anything to firmly. They just lalalal about vague ideas.

Shannon

At the end of the day we are all allowed to have our own point of view - you can't please all of the people all of the time, but you can please some of the people, some of the time.

I certainly see how most Europeans view America good and bad, but I won't go there. Because despite 10 good points and 1 bad - people like to jump on the "bad" bandwagon.

Live and let live eh :lol:

Being that America was founded by Europeans in particular, and does contain every ethnic and religeous group the world has to offer,perhaps its fair to say that the world loves and hates America as it loves and hates itself.Is it fair to say that others see a reflection of themselves in us and dont ALWAYS like what they see. Americas strength is that it contains everyone.
On the lighter side,if you view the version of "America" from the DVD "Volkerball" which came out in 2006 you may find as I did that the atmosphere was rather positive(despite "Freedom Fries" and much animosity over the Iraq war) A German band chose to include this song and a french audiance chose to embrace it.

I found this video of Amerika at Volkerball
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xE7PVUPRepM
and I don't see much difference in the versions, just lots of people having fun expressing anger at the US.

Unless I'm missing something?

This post is nearly 3 years old

well I wasn't going to comment on anything on the forum during my self imposed cooling off period - BUT how can I avoid a phiosophical discussion like this?

All I can say is look at the exit survey discussion and see what happens when someone tries to offer a real critique. I would say it's a great metaphor regarding how Americans see their place in the world and their role in it. Disagree with me and I will insult you and shout you down.

What I hate about traveling in the last what 25 years is so many places are the same. Gone are the smaller stores that give a place character - Walmart and Target are everywhere. WHy would I want to got to Paris for McDonald's? WHen I was i college and we went to Paris you couldn't even find Coke, it forced you to partake of local cuisine and beverages. Its sad in many ways.

And we should be ashamed of our inner city poverty that flourishes while we sell coke to the world. I don't usually take entertainment at more than face valuebut Ron, nice to think about it in a different way once in while.

kerry wrote:

What I hate about traveling in the last what 25 years is so many places are the same. Gone are the smaller stores that give a place character - Walmart and Target are everywhere. WHy would I want to got to Paris for McDonald's? WHen I was i college and we went to Paris you couldn't even find Coke, it forced you to partake of local cuisine and beverages. Its sad in many ways.

Sounds familiar. I think one of my most striking memories while visiting Budapest when I was in grad school - I was on my way from Vienna to Bergen and decided to detour - was seeing a Pizza Hut! I was floored :lol:

Of course, as Europeans we all bitch about it. And then when I travelled to some friends' wedding in Stockholm a few years later the locals insisted we all stop at Mickey D's for lunch :roll:

Frankly, though, the sameness of franchises such as these has its advantages. When I'm on the road in the US I'm struck by how I'm drawn to what I know no matter where I am, just because then I don't have to think about it. Familiarity may breed contempt, or at least complacency, but there is also something oddly comforting about it I guess :wink:

As for hating American culture...it does seem to suck the life out of local cultures. But then again if it didn't have appeal, it wouldn't take hold. And that can be said about the influence of any leading power.

There have been hegemons in the past amd history tells us that their power evenutally wanes. Enjoy being hated while you can ;-)

When the rest of the world stops making snide comments about American culture, THEN you should start to worry.

Reminds me of a good friend of mine with a much-winning dog. She's new to the game. The first time she was verbally attacked for no good reason I took her aside and told her: "hey, that just proves that you've ARRIVED kiddo. Your success has made you a worthy target. Congratulations!" :lol:

Kristine

I love your posts Kristine!!

kerry wrote:

All I can say is look at the exit survey discussion and see what happens when someone tries to offer a real critique. I would say it's a great metaphor regarding how Americans see their place in the world and their role in it. Disagree with me and I will insult you and shout you down.

That is true in so many ways. It's sad but then everyone always wants everyone else to agree with them so they feel accepted and reinforces their own viewpoint.

Well written Kristine ...

I'd pack my bags and move the US any day, so many of my ex colleagues at Intel did, any chance they got to move over they took it and not one of them looked back.

I remember being in Italy one holiday and despite all the fantasitc food and it is fantastic, I thought mmmm I could eat a Big Mac and the familiarity just puts a huge smile on your face :wink:

I've been thinking about your response a lot, Kristine.

I've certainly heard the jealousy angle before, but isn't it SOOO HARD to differentiate between real (and debatably justifiable) anger and jealousy?

Back in my pre-retirement days, I worked for the department of Defense and traveled overseas on occasion. One of my more memorable trips included a late, late night at a Beer House in Frankfurt Germany where my co-worker and I stopped for a taste of the local brew. It was basically an Internation Event. I remember sitting with 5 "blokes" from Great Britain and discussing the threat of nuclear war with them over more than a couple of liters of the best beer I ever had. Their concerns were focused on the repercussions of any possible United States actions and how they would effect the rest of the world. They realized that we, in the States were relatively safe, even from nuclear attack, but they and all other Europeans were not. We have been and continue to be the most powerful nation in the world, but so was the Roman Empire at one time. How people view us, at least in this instance was entirely based on how our actions could essentially eliminate a large portion of the worlds population. These folks realized their destiny could be controlled by the Big Guys across the pond of whom they had no influence on. It can be pretty intimidating.

I would have instantly reminded them that their own little European skirmish dragged the US into a war that it wasn't looking to join.

The world was a small place then and is an even smaller place now and events anywhere have effects on everyone.

baileesdad wrote:

Their concerns were focused on the repercussions of any possible United States actions and how they would effect the rest of the world. They realized that we, in the States were relatively safe, even from nuclear attack, but they and all other Europeans were not. We have been and continue to be the most powerful nation in the world, but so was the Roman Empire at one time. How people view us, at least in this instance was entirely based on how our actions could essentially eliminate a large portion of the worlds population. These folks realized their destiny could be controlled by the Big Guys across the pond of whom they had no influence on. It can be pretty intimidating.

Amen and in a nutshell.

On a lighter note <? :lol:

>

Reagan frequently made statements that put the fear of - something - in a lot of Europeans, me included. We all thought he was certifiable based on his lack of geopolitical understanding. Or shall we say the Soviet Union looked a lot different when you're staring right across the border at it and you're one of those rash countries who felt aligning themselves with the US/NATO and allowing access to bases and sensitive areas that really did not make our neighbors very happy with us was a GOOD strategy when one of your allies <?> suddenly decides to gamble the future of your nation without consulting you and that should you be obliterated, well, that's a price he's willing to pay :wink:

Anyway, thus was the climate when I graduated from "gymnas", roughly the equivalent of American high school. Every year the graduates (russ - no reflection on any nationality :wink:

) from all of the gymnas in a given town/city have their own little parade on our equivalent of your independence day (May 17th) where groups of us made up lots of little floats. I was in the group spoofing the US and whatever their missile of the day was, Trident something, I think, with a soon to be geology student and my physics lab partner impersonating Reagan (badly), in cowboy boots and hat seated in my (English - ooops) saddle astride a rather large faux missile attached to the roof of somebody's car shooting off some peashooter of some kind.

Ah, them's the days. Were we seriously upset with the US? Yes and no. Were we a wee bit drunk? Not as much as I thought considering I actually remember the float and what prompted it :wink:

Kristine

Actually they all had nothing but good feelings toward us. They were very much Pro-America. Their concerns had to do with things they couldn't have an input to. My point is we really don't realize what an impact decisions made here may have on the day to day lives of everyone else in the world. They constantly mentioned their homes had "Thatched Roofs" and they envisioned burned out ruins.

Ron wrote:

Is it?

There is real reason for anger over certain actions of certain adminstrations. Oddly enough, American administrations, some at least, often seem to have had an uncanny ability to cost their allies more than they cost their enemies. :roll:

That's the political level. The fine balancing act of a hegemon, and especially one that appears to be in its decline like the US is now - financially, militarily, resources stretched almost to the limits - is that in additon to the resources that put you at the top, to be able to remain there, you need not only to maintain if not increase access to those resources, but you need to do so in a way that is seen as benefitting more than just yourself to maintain what will become increasingly necessary alliances. I.e. there is a legitimacy issue. The problem is that the harder you have to scramble to maintain the number one position, the greater the pressure to serve only your own interests.

Beyond that, though, there is a residual cultural jealousy <?> that is basically institutionalized.

You'll have to imagine the bizarre dual world I've lived in all my life - half Norwegian, half American, dual citizenship, grew up in both countries, went to school in both. Heck, I have graduate degrees from universities in both.

It wasn't until I returned to Norway for grad school after having lived in the US for several years as an adult that I realized how much of the anti-americanism was ingrained, knee-jerk. There was no real kick to it. The "anti" had become something that in itself defined the culture it was ingrained in: something universally accepted and understood, uncritical and unquestioning.

I remember attending a concert where one of the top symphony orchestras in Norway celebrated an evening of American composers such as Gershwin and the likes with the Russian (!! :lol:

) conductor dressed up in the most ridiculous way in a characterature of American "culture" (or lack thereof, I guess, was the point) that I found disturbingly offensive, but which the Europeans I attended with found hysterically funny. I walked off on my own for a while on the way home until a French friend of mine caught up with me and asked me if I was upset and why and I told him and I could tell he didn't really understand, but, he was nice enough about it and tried to humor me.

To this day I question why that particular incident struck me as so disturbingly offensive. And I really think it did so because no one else saw it as anything but normal. Ridiculing American culture had become in and of itself a way of life.

Kristine

I'm confused. Could someone tell me what the rest of the world is jealous about regarding America? I'll make it easy, leave out the homeless situation, the teen pregnancy situation, the medicare system ,or lack thereoff , the economy, the crime, the death penalty, the violence, the education system, the fact that there is more african americans in jail than their are in college, the obesity, the child welfare system, the welfare system in general.......and the list goes on! No country is perfect, but don't assume all of them copy and are grateful America exists. Have you looked at China yet as a super power? Did you know that if a war was started involving China, even with the one child policy, they could man the event for a hundred years with the reproduction system they have now. What if they decided to let their folks have as many children as they liked with the freedom of their country in mind? And trust me folks, the Chinese love their country, with all it's faults, and would defend it to the death! I'm glad I'm down her in Australasia. I know who my money is on!

Anonymous wrote:

I'll make it easy, leave out the homeless situation,

There are some homeless

Anonymous wrote:

the teen pregnancy situation,

Not a big issue, especially if we want to fight those pesky Chinese kids(???)

Anonymous wrote:

the medicare system ,or lack thereoff ,

Medicare is working -mostly- for a gazillion retirees

Anonymous wrote:

the economy,

Well, a down year or two after 25 up is expected

Anonymous wrote:

the crime,

Crime is way, way down over the last 10 years or more, there might be an uptick with the downturn in the economy

Anonymous wrote:

the death penalty,

More than half the people support the death penalty

Anonymous wrote:

the violence,

Glad I'm not in peaceful places like Paris and .. where was that G20 thingy held?

Anonymous wrote:

the education system,

Seems to be educating lots and lots of really top notch people, despite the spending of more money than anyone on primary education

Anonymous wrote:

the fact that there is more african americans in jail than their are in college,

That's a shame

Anonymous wrote:

the obesity,

Fat and happy, what's so odd about that?

Anonymous wrote:

the child welfare system,

You getting your news from John and Kate + 8?

Anonymous wrote:

the welfare system in general

What's wrong with it?

Anonymous wrote:

Did you know that if a war was started involving China, even with the one child policy, they could man the event for a hundred years with the reproduction system they have now. What if they decided to let their folks have as many children as they liked with the freedom of their country in mind?

That is the most bizarro non-sequitur. What's the point, there's lots people? (Half of whom are in the US getting one of those substandard edumacations you referred to.)

Good luck to you and your wager, guest.

I can only assume that by the times you log your posts, your own description of yourself and the $ amount you think will buy you a decent car that you are one of the welfare recipients that think the american system works. Free food vouchers, free medicare, free this, free that, sucking off the taxpayer. It not only sounds as if you haven't worked in the real world for a long time but also that you have never been further that the local walmart in your travels. Don't forget, those pesky chinese are probably paying taxes to support you. I laughed when I read your post denying all the faults in america. You proved my point for me. The ostrich syndrome followed by the I'm o.k. who cares about any one else follow up. Then came the use big words and see if people are impressed ending. Hmm, typical american. If unsure of the facts, baffle them with your bull. I was of the misguided impression that this was a dog forum I had found, instead I find it's a forum for bigots, racists and any female with health problems to ramble on. Your attitude is the reason most other countries dislike americans in general. A group of loud, obnoxious and self serving people with no tolerance for any one else around them that has a different opinion. Now if you will excuse me I must go to work to pay my taxes. There are a lot of bludgers out there that rely on me.

Anonymous wrote:

This forum is for males with health problems, too. Please don't sell us short.

Pretty funny. In one sentence you castigate the US for the lack of a medicare system, and in the next you attack for giving stuff away for free. Well, at least you're inconsistent.

You found a dog forum, and you have chosen to participate in an attack mode as an anonymous poster within the "Food for Thought" section. I guess you don't wanna talk dogs either.

As for the women's health issues, I hope that someone finding the handful of threads concerning women's health get the single repeated sentiment encouraging them to go see their doctor (you know, the one for which you are either in favor or not in favor of publicly funding). Just so you know, people are not turned away from emergency rooms in the US for life-threatening conditions due to an inability to pay, and (just guessing here) ectopic pregnancies might be considered an emergency. It is one of the reasons that insurance premiums are as high as they are.

As for your assumption about my economic status, the convertible I'm looking for is for a little summer fun and would be my 4th current vehicle. I would have bought one already, except that I sit way too tall to be able to see out of cars that are built for normal folks. I usually drive larger vehicles, see http://happiecamper.com/html/gallery.html for two of them. And yes! I still own both.

Good luck to you, guest. I hope you find a constructive outlet for your anger.

ButtersStotch wrote:

This forum is for males with health problems, too. Please don't sell us short.

:kiss:

ROFL - and Ron, do us a favor and block the IP address of this snarky "guest", please? Pretty please? :lol:

Or, if not can we all just forget the cup of tea stuff on this one and say

Ron you ask how the rest of the world views the USA, obviously that will depend upon the influences that the USA has on an individual.

I for one am a long time Neil Young fan - this is a man who makes no bones expressing opinions about certain sections of the USA in his music and obviously doesn't please all of the people all of the time :lol:

You will get as many differing opinions as there are people you ask.

I'd rather get to know people - not peoples but individuals, I form my opinions on them, how could I class people from the various states as one people?

We have family ties in NC so aren't totally talking from soley having experiences as expressed from the outside of the US.

How do people outside of Europe view the European Union?

Just a side note on the 'same outlets everywhere you go' thing. Here in the UK all the towns are rapidly becoming the same, you get the same stores everywhere you go, in the same formation, same structure, same architecture. It's like someone has taken a town and pressed copy & paste all over the UK. There are one or two places you might find different shops but these are generally expensive boutique areas or towns which have not YET been modernised. We were paying our first visit to a town a while back, Greg works for HMV. He wanted to go see the local store to compare. "There's the Arcade, it must be in there" Sure enough it was! It was easy to find because it was next to the same store as a few other branches that we already know of. I don't think it's Americanised as such, just because there are the larger fast food chains in the mix, I think we have those which are from other cultures too, but some bright spark might have said "it works in the US, lets do the same here" Probably because it's a cheaper way of doing things.

I personally would like to see the character of our towns being preserved, and I think in some cases they are, once you travel out of the main towns a bit.

As for judging a nation, I take each person one at a time too. And I would move to the US at the drop of a hat.

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