Invitro or leave it alone?
Incase some have forgot or don't know me, I will refresh a bit. I have 2 children, a girl that is 6, and a boy that is 5. We had to have them by c-section, and hubby didn't want more, or for me to have another c-section...so at the time we decided to have the tubes tied. Jan 2005, I learned I was pregnant. My dr said everything appeared to be fine, and baby was in the uterus. I was thrilled. A week or so later, we lost the baby. I had the hsg test, dye in tubes...right side open and left side still closed. Not likely gonna get pregnant, but was advised to use protection. I tried every wives tale to help me get pregnant again, and it wasn;t happening. Went back to my dr, mad at everything, depressed over it, and wanted some sort of way to fix their mistake, and make me pregnat again. It was very upsetting, every month is a reminder ... when AF comes. She said healthcare will NOT pay for a reversal. My only option is invitro. The specialist will see us in a couple weeks...takes months to be seen. Which begs the questions... a) Will I feel satisfied and this feeling of loss go away? b) Should I worry about the age difference of my 2 children and the baby? c) Hubby acknowledges he doesn't feel the loss of the baby, and says he doesn't want anymore....altho he loves being a dad to the 2 we have. He can't get past the money aspects of it. He feels we can't afford anymore, and the two we have can have a good life if we both work....I can go back to work in Sept 06. (retail) d) I feel stuck, and can't get past it. My desire to have more children has always been strong, since our son was 6 mths old...I regretted the tubal. Now I see babies and cry, I see pregnant women and long for the feeling of it all again. I want to see first steps, and first words, and all of that. I understand the money issues, but I have my own soultions for them...we don't need this house, this area of our city (the nicest/more expensive), we don't need brand name proucts...etc. Has anyone been through a misscarriage, and have these feelings? Have you had more children...did the loss go away and make you happy, or did you have regret's adding to the family? I hate having these strong feelings, and at the same time I am not blind to the everyday work of children...it can be tough. But at the end of the day I love the kids, and I "think" a big family would be a good thing for everyone. I was an only child and hated it, hubby came froma family of 3 brothers and 1 sister...he hated it. 
Any thoughts? Sorry for the long post. |
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| I totally understand where you are coming from....
I almost went ahead with the surgery to have my tubes undone (or more accurately, reanastimosed) The surgery has huge success rates now, and the cost is coming down. There is a specialist in Windsor, Ontario who does this on a regular basis and the last time I checked, the surgery is only about 4000 through him. I've been to see him twice, had tests run which determined I am in good health and he feels it would be successful. In vitro is not covered either, is usually between 6000 and 20,000 per try. It is more often unsuccessful on the first or even second try. When it is successful you have a much higher chance of a mulitple pregnancy, so you need to be sure you would want that and are prepared for that. In regards to your questions.... all my answers are of course only my own personal opinion.... A) Who knows, I thought that feeling would never go away, I thought I would not be happy with my choice unless I at least made the effort to have it reversed and try to have another baby. You know what, I think it has passed. Sometimes, like right now, lol, I'm not sure... but at this point in my life I don't *think* I will regret it too much if I do not have it reversed. B) No. I have 2 brothers, one is 38 and one is 19, I am close to both and though our relationships are different, we are family and that's all that matters. My cousin had her first child, then twins 2 years later, and had her tubes tied as well. She had it reversed and within 3 months was pregnant with her youngest who is 10 years younger than her twins. They all are normal sibling relationships, except maybe even more enjoyable. C) It does need to be a decision you both feel right about. Perhaps consider some counselling, or speaking with a financial planner? In reality though, how many of us got to plan to have children at just the right time? We tend to make things work. D) Those are hard feelings to get past. I felt I needed to work through that before making my decision because I didn't want to have a baby only because I felt it would make me happier. I needed to be happy "as is" and then would have more to offer my family if I chose to have another baby. What it all boils down to though is you will do what you feel is best for you, your family, and the potential baby to be. You do not need to be rich to raise a happy, healthy child. You do not need to have a huge home, expensive material things, brand names etc... If I waited to have children til I was well off, I'd not have had them even now. We have not had it easy at times, but I think we're doing just fine, and I'm proud of my kids and love them very much so I wouldn't change a thing. |
| I can't answer any of your questions, only you know what is right for you. But You do have my heartfelt sympathy in such a difficult situation. I have also had a couple of miscarriages, one over 30 years ago, and I don't think you ever really get over the "loss". You move past it and heal from it but it is always a loss. Good Luck with your decisions. |
| First I want to say I am so sorry for your loss. I miscarried with our first. Now almost 30 years later, I still wonder from time to time what would have been.
Even as a child, I always wanted a house full of children. When our second son was born with spina bifida, it was a very hard decision to not have any more. Again, I think about it from time to time but don't dwell on it. I accept our decision as what was best for our family and have moved on. Now let me tell you how things turned out. Our house became a second home for most of my sons friends. One would come home with him after school every day and get something to eat and visit because there was no one waiting for him at his own house. There always seemed to be one or two extras on the weekend. Sometimes a head would pop in the kitchen and say "What's for supper Mom", maybe there would be an extra plate set, maybe not, depending on if dinner was desirable! Even when Justin wasn't home, sometimes someone would come over here to hang out. I have always been glad that this is a place his friends feel welcomed and safe. I would much rather have them here underfoot then out getting in trouble. When Jonathon started school, I went to work for the school. I worked for 13 years in special education. I worked with young children with severe disabilities. It was one of the most rewarding things I have ever done. Also over the years at different times, we have taken in three teenagers. Now I have two beautiful "foster" grandbabies. I guess what I am trying to say is that things have a way of working themselves out. Even though I gave birth to only 2 children, I have had a house full and a multitude of others that have filled my heart. |
| What a hard decision. I'm sorry you're struggling so much with this, and your husband and you aren't necessarily seeing exactly eye-to-eye. Since you're asking for opinions... I would not have another one if it "were me" if my husband wasn't just as excited as I was about having one. Despite my deepest desires, they wouldn't be fulfilled in the end if my husband wasn't sailing on the same boat as me. Even though I know he'd be excited if we produced one more than we "planned out" ...it could possibly cause some unneeded arguments, resentment that's held in especially when money becomes an issue, or uneeded resentment towards the kid(s). But... for me and how I guess I differ is.. if having another child meant leaving the lifestyle we currently have, then I would agree we couldn't afford one and stop. If we had one unplanned... then that would be when I would happily do whatever is necessary.
My sister in law is in a situation almost identical ...but different. She has been trying for over 8 years to have a baby. She thinks the world of children and has paid more than most people could afford to help the process move along. She's even willing to adopt, but her husband would rather it be from him. He views it as "if we're meant to have children.. we'll have them.. if not, then I'll think about adopting." Well,needless to say.. it's been 8 years, and they still haven't adopted. For the past year, it's looked like they weren't even going to have kids. I truly felt some resentment when I got pregnant. You have no idea the amount of drugs she's on and the things they've done to try to get pregnant. Anywho... now she's doing what she never wanted to do ...which is invitro (this april). This is her last shot. I can't imagine how depressed she will be if she doesn't get pregnant. I can't even imagine trying for so long .............well, especially since the first time Ryan and I... was on our wedding night and well.. we got pregnant. |
| Thanks everyone, I really appreciate the input. I guess I figured by the time 1 year passed, I should have some sort of closure.
I have invloved myself alot with the kids school stuff, help out when I can, do more with the dogs etc...keeps my mind off of thoughts of babies again. I seemed to be coping, and finally about 5 mths after talking with my dr, the specialist called to say they have an appt set up for me now. Now it's all back in full force...all of the feelings I was "coping' with. My obgyn suggested to skip trying the reversal and go straight for the invitro. It does bother me that we have to spend money to have the procedure, and the costs after that are covered by our health care. My dr implied that I don't have fertility issues, so they should be able to go in get the eggs and basically mix the two, and implant, and I'd be pregnant right away....verses most invitro patients need supplements, and drugs, and it takes a year before they may see results. As was mentioned by Jo's sister's experience... I'd also have to decided if we take the chance on twins, or try one at a time. They retrieve and then freeze the rest for a later try. I LOVE my husband dearly, he provides a good life for us, and is a awesome dad to the kids. But I have resented for a long time his decsions for me to have the original tying....I should never have done it, but he convinced me that we were set now, with the two. "perfect family" I don't want to resent him anymore about it, I have to go through with this. He understands that, and when this appt came available they want him included. So he's coming with, and we will get all the info about it, and the cost info. I was finally getting past my feelings about the original tying and was actually planning my life with available options...I had one year to decide what I was gonna do...school, work, start a business?? The the pregancy has changed everything, altho a very short one, I can't believe what an impact it had on me. I just don't think we will ever come to a place where we both feel satisfied...he's pretty firm on the money issue...not just the procedure but the expense of babies, children...it's ongoing. After all he is our breadwinner, and I don't want him to feel resentment to me either. I want a big family, and I want the kids to have more siblings because I hated coming home to an empty house. I want them to grow old and know they will always have someone they can turn too. I appreciate the times Rob's brothers come together and help us. It's one thng to have a best friend in school...but now I feel alone as an adult...so many times I think if I just had a sister. Parker the other day was confused why we are going to hospital to see my cousins baby...he thought with the stuff we bought we were bringing her home with us, but he asked if we could get a boy instead, he wants a brother. He also mentioned how much he loves having sister here, he misses her when she is not around. He won't tell her that tho  .
Maybe after this appt, and when the dr says we are great candidate or NOT..I might have closure. I believe the procedure of reversal is not an option the way my dr did it...not enough tube left to put back together. She also gave me the impression of a dollar amount of $4000 to have an invitro, she will try and help with the costs. I wish I could say I had a bad pregnancy, the throwing up etc, to a bad delivery, or colicy babies etc...but honestly it was the best time in my life, it went so smoothly both times...aside from the c-sec, it was a wonderful experience. I enjoyed every moment...and still do, we have two great well behaved kids, are good in school, and healthy. We have had it easy. Now to convince hubby we can change things and still be in a good place. I've even asked as many parents that I know in the school who have 2 kids, and then those who have 3-4...those that have 3-4 all say the same thing, more work on day to day, but wouldn't change a thing. Hotels are harder as well...they want you take 2 rooms. We already have a vehicle that seats 6...Tahoe with 2 row. Our house is fine too, the kids bedrooms are huge, plenty of room to sharezies. The down side is we need everything again to do with babies, but we also know family will hand down things, I have a friend passing on stuff soon. I have no problem shopping at second hand places, for used baby stuff...I am not that vain. After all it's a choice 1 outfit for $30, or 4-5 for $30...doesn't make any sense to waste that kind of money. Hubby knows that too. I just want what I want, but I can't ignore what hubby wants. But the last time I agreed with him I was so mad at him, and it has somewhat affected me. If he says no, I will still love him, but I know I will take along time to get past it. If he says yes, then it's possible he will use this as guilt punishment against me...for example we need a new something, and he says we can't you got your baby instead. In the moment kinda thing...he does it now with the dog. But he will love the baby I have no doubts on that. He would never let the baby know he wasn't happy he/she was here....it would never be about the physical baby, just the fact what it took to have him/her. I am also 33, he is 35...my clock is also running out of time....I want to have fun with the kids, as well as grandchildren. I want to be a fun grandma if they have children. I want big family dinners, vacations together...their friends are always welcome to come over but so far we haven't been that kinda house. I'm one of those people who love my own kids more than other peoples kids...and we would not foster/adopt, we exhausted that option and felt it wasn't right for us. I would adopt a baby, if I felt the babies parents would always leave us alone...and that's selfish of me. So I don't think I could do it, but it tears me apart to know how many kids are unwanted in other lands...here we have mostly fetal alcohol babies, or abused children, and I had to decide that we can't put the family through it all...they come with alot of baggage, and it's alot to consider. I send hugs and support to those that do this everyday...they don't recieve enough support. Again thanks for all your thoughts, I will let you know what they say at the appt. I just want to know if I am doing this for the right reasons, children should never brought into a situation that can't embrace it 100%...esp if it has to be planned like invitro. |
| Just my 2 cents...
3 changes everything! I adore my boys (3,6 and  and would not change a thing, however, it is completely different from 2 kids. We actually have talked about how easy it is when one is playing at a friend's house and we just have 2 at home. 3 is a challenge because you are outnumbered  You cannot divide and conquer when all three need your attention. You have to be patient and they have to be patient.
We were on a field trip today and 2 of the moms I rode with have 3 as well. We were talking about what a challenge it is to keep up with reading and homework every night especially with soccer, art, and/or tennis lessons added to the mix. Finding balance.... I know your longing. I had it too so I really should keep my big mouth shut! But it really is much more work with 3 than it ever was with 2. Especially with 3 boys! The laundry and keeping them fed is enough to wipe you out
If your hubby gets gung ho after the Dr's visit- you go girl! Otherwise, you might want to get another puppy  |
| Larkels...that's what hubby says too, being an uneven # will be hard on them. He was the middle child of 5, and he HATED it, all of it, the sharing rooms, lack of attention, picked on by brothers...and so on.
But with the age difference, their can't possibly be that rivalry, of a middle child...6 years apart between youngest and future baby. When they become 10+ years old...they will be able to visit and hang with friends, and I will have one at home. Then when one is 30 and the baby is 24...they can be best friends, sharing together their own life experieices...right??? I of course want 4, not three...I would choose to have the twins, rather than 1 at a time....because of the c-section. And I will have the freedom of both in school all day, and I am home with the babies...and they are old enough to not need me as much. They are capable of making toast, or cereal and milk..that type of need. I think it will feel like I have 2 then 2, not 4 all at once. My two now are so independent, I am bascially here to wash their clothes and make meals... I think they will be a big help if needed.
But yeah, hubby is not on the same page. He acknowledges I have an emotional thing he can't connect with, and he feels more would be a challenge that we can't handle. |
| I come from a family of 8 kids. We had nothing growing up. Never went on vacation trips, never had a nice home or a nice car. Never had any friends over because we did not have enough to feed them or a place to sleep them. Always thift store and hand-me-down clothes. My siblings and I were always embarrased fo our home and situation. No money for university for any of us.
I loved being pregnant. It was a very magical time. My husband is a great dad, and loved being a dad to our boys and we did tons of volunteer stuff with their sports etc. Then I started thinking about another one, but wasn't 100% sure. Hubby was not interested. So I started doing volunteer stuff with kids, like the young offenders (juvenile deliguents), and then doing transports for the Children's Aid Society, supervising visitations, and then fostering for the Children's Aid. What an eye-opener to the families and the kids out there that are struggling. So number 3 for me never came, but I put in many years trying to make a difference with kids that were not so lucky as mine. And I now that my boys are teens I am so glad that I did not bring another child into this world, with the mess it is in. I have enough of a time trying to cope with the two teens I have now, so I admit that I would not be able to do it. I guess if it happened, we would deal with it, but given the choice NO WAY! |
| Nicole that is so awesome you could do that, I don't have that in me. I am not a huge volunteer in things...if it was for dogs instead of people perhaps I would.
Can I ask tho, thinking back to your childhood was it overall happy? Large family meals at holidays...with the new wives and husbands, and children...wasn't that enjoyable? Are you close to your sisters and brothers? Do you feel secure in knowing someone is always there? My grandparents raised me, after they already had 9 children. When their youngest daughter died of leukemia I kinda filled the void, and made them happy. I was even included in my grandfather's will, I lived alone with him for many years cause my grandma had died of breast cnacer when I was 9 years old...so it became just me and him for 8 years. I loved it when my aunt's and uncles all came home...and the house was active, but then when everyone was gone we were very lonely. Both my parents are alive, but I am not conected to either of them...these were my dad's parents. I am so afraid that these kids will lose the other, and feel alone. To this day I have no conections with someone close...no coffee dates, shopping friends, parents who's kids come over etc...I have made some lovely aquaintences with the other mom's at school, but not friendships like 2 sisters would share. Of course I am looking through rose colored glasses of the unknown, but I can't help but think it would be lovely to have a close sibling of the same gender. Granted 8 children is alot, my friend in school was the youngest of 13 kids...she was only close to those closest in age to her, the rest felt like aunt's and uncles/babysitters. I am only considering 1-2 more, making a few sacrifices should be doable. |
| My parents had 8 kids in 10 years, so we are all pretty close in age. Some siblings hated each other the whole time growing up, and some were best friends. We never brought boyfriends etc home, and by the time the marriages came along we had all moved out all spread across Canada, so the getogethers happen in smaller groups. And now it is the spouses who don't like the siblings etc., so the same family dynamics, but multiplied
Some of us are closer than others. I guess we had some fun times growing up, always someone to play board games and cards with. All of us were VERY anxious to leave home, though. We each left by the time we were 17 years old. Money does nto make a happy home, but we were very poor and I would have loved to go to school to be a vet. I don't remember speaking to my mother between the ages of 14 to 16. I got onto the wrong side of the track, so to speak, and was hardly ever home. She had 7 other kids to worry about, some were real visable problems, so I guess I just flew under the radar. My father does not have a relationship with any of us. The children only live together for part of their life. Yes, we love to get together now and we laugh etc, but as for supporting each other, well, once you are married your own family takes priorty and the spouses have a say in a lot of that. My husband comes from a family of 4 boys, and one lives with us. He does not speak to the other 2 at all. I think you need to figure out WHY you want more children. From my experience having kids for your kids is not a good reason, but my situation may not be a good example. |
Bosley's mom wrote: The children only live together for part of their life. Yes, we love to get together now and we laugh etc, but as for supporting each other, well, once you are married your own family takes priorty and the spouses have a say in a lot of that.
I think you need to figure out WHY you want more children. From my experience having kids for your kids is not a good reason, but my situation may not be a good example. Hmm good points to think about. I guess I am looking for the support i assume comes with having siblings...such as guardians for children, that person whom just knows without needing the details, someone to give you a hug when you need it...can;t get a hug from hubby if he;s the reason you need a hug
But I understand that once you get married your partner is everything, but everyone needs a break and grab a coffee...going alone just isn't the same. If I had a sister, or a brother and his wife ... I get that sometimes that doesn't work that way. Hubby's brothers are all single. Hmmm the why: When I had our first, I knew I wanted 4, I had no idea she'd result in a c-sec, and our dr advised 3 c-sec limit. We didn't want 3, we didn't want an odd #...hubby wasn;t gonna let me have 4. I didn;t think 2 was a good #, and our dr advised me against it. I was really torn between what I wanted and what hubby wanted, after all he was the breadwinner not me. Now knowing we are good parents, we have good kids, we can afford nice things...so to sacrifice would be doable if we had allowed ourselves the ability for more kids. I've realised how much I hated being alone, I was taken advantage of as a child because no one was around to protect me...my grandfather was working the fields until late hours. I;d be left alone for hours from the age of 10 +. No one ever knew...I was confused. I want saftey in #'s, I want the kids to feel like someone is always there with them if mom and dad are not. I guess my reasons are all selfish reasons. I want to be surrounded by love, and family, and good memories....and the kids can have security in their lives too. |
Daisie wrote: I guess I am looking for the support i assume comes with having siblings...such as guardians for children, that person whom just knows without needing the details, someone to give you a hug when you need it...
I know you have the best of intentions, but you can't plan the future for yourself or your children. For every example you find of a large close loving family, there are going to be an equal number of examples of large families who are not close or have completely lost touch. Although I love my only sibling (brother) and his wonderful wife, we've lived across the country from each other since I graduated college. I'm much closer to the girlfriends I met in my 20s. They are like sisters to me, and are always there to support me (and vice versa!). I couldn't ask for a better group of "sisters". So definitely do what you think is the right thing for your family, because only you can make that decision. But be sure to weigh both the impact it will have now, in addition to what you hope will happen someday. I'm wishing the best for you (and sending a virtual sisterly hug!). Sue |
((((BIG HUGS)))) I remember that we had our miscarriages around the same time, and I know it still hurts. I still sometimes think, "Wow, I should have a 6 month old. I wonder how different our life would be?" I'm really wanting another baby also. Brandon just turned 3, Jake is about to turn 5 and head to kindergarten in August. My babies are growing up on me and are getting VERY independent too.  Heck, even Jake woke me up the other morning, and he had toasted me waffles and poured me a glass of orange juice. Very sweet for a 4 year old.  It did make me sad though that he's able to do stuff like that (he can use the toaster but he knows not to touch the stove). I'm NOT ready for them to grow up, lol
Another part of my wanting is that I want my little girl that was given to me and taken away. My entire life, I saw myself as a mother of a daughter. I want the memories I had with my mom to share with her. I just can't do it with the boys, nor will they be interested in it when they're older. Right now, they're both mama's boys, but I know their interests and everything will change when they're older. Jason will seem to be the more active parent, just because he will have more of the same interests. Right now, neither have much to do with Jason - not that they don't love him, they just love me a lot more. Jason can't even hold or touch my 3 year old if I'm in the room - he'll tell him only I can. I see it starting to slowly change with Jake as he gets older though. He's getting interested in video games, sports, motorcycles, airplanes, GI Joes (soldiers), etc.. and Jason is the one he talks to about those things. In my heart, I just don't think we're finished. There's just someone missing. Jason says I'll always feel that way, even if we have 20 kids, because I DO have a child (two if you count the miscarriage) missing. Now, I miss Kayla. I really do, and I am thinking of her a lot lately as her 6th birthday is approaching. However, I have accepted what happened. I'm finally at peace with it. I think I would have been a good mom to her, but I know because of what happened to her, I'm the best mom that my boys could ask for. It made me not take the lives of my loved ones for granted. It's still painful, I still cry at least once a week thinking about her, but my two little guys have truly made me happy again. As happy as they make me, they just don't fill that empty spot I'm feeling though. Jason was always the one who wanted our babies. I wanted to wait until I finished college, but Jason has a way of talking me into things... He talked me into trying one time for Kayla, and well, it only took once. He was deployed state-side at the time, and I was very, very surprised. We had only been married for 6 months, and I had only known Jason a year, lol. After it had a few minutes to sink in though, I was happy.
Jake was really both of us. We just needed a baby to fill our arms. There wasn't even talk about a baby. As soon as we got the doctor's okay, we started trying again for another baby. I don't think he'll ever know how much he was wanted, or how grateful I am to him that he made it okay to love something as much and be happy again. He still is a comfort to me whenever he hugs me, and if anything ever happened to him, I wouldn't be able to get past that. He is my angel on Earth. Brandon - I wasn't ready for another. No where near it. Jake was in NICU as an infant, he was VERY colicky (10-12 hours of straight screaming EVERY single day) even at 9 months. Jason was leaving for Operation Endurring Freedom, and he wanted another baby. I held off until he said... "What if this is the last thing I ever to get ask you and you turn me down." Grr, lol I should have known better, but I agreed. The boys are 18 months apart. It was HARD, especially since Brandon was born premature and he had a ton of problems for his first year and spent his first 2 weeks in the NICU. He really shouldn't be here today, because his lungs weren't developed at birth, he got sepsis (a blood infection), a staph infection, and his kidneys failed because of his antibiotics Christmas day the year he was born. Then, for about the first 6 month, his heartrate would slow down, even stop, and his breathing would stop. It was a VERY scary and stressful time. Now, he's the healthiest, happiest little boy. He's always done everything very early, and he never gets sick. It's hard to imagine he was a little guy struggling for life when he was born. He loves being the center of attention and always makes everyone laugh. I couldn't imagine my life without him in it, and I'm grateful Jason talked me into it now. He is totally my little guy and my sunshine. Then we had the miscarriage. We had just started talking about having a baby, and two weeks later I got a postive test. I know we weren't really being careful then, but I think that was our first "oops". I've also had 3 c-sections since I can only have c-sections. That was a worry too. My last doctor wasn't too concerned about it though since everything has healed well each time. He did tell me I shouldn't of had 3 major surgeries in less than 3 years though. I SHOULDN'T want a baby, especially all that we've been through with ours. In my head, I know that. I have two gorgeous little boys, and I am happy with them. My heart on the other hand says I need another baby to love. It doesn't help that Jake and Brandon have been asking for a sibling, too. Everyone wants one but Jason. He said we've been through enough, and he's not chancing it again. So, after this long post, if you feel in your heart that you want another, I say go for it. It won't be easy, but it sounds like you really want another. Like I said, after all of that, I shouldn't want another. I do though. Jason says I wouldn't be happy if it was another boy. I say he's wrong. I would be disappointed for maybe a day after the ultrasound, but I would be happy. I cried when we found out Brandon was a boy, but I'm not sad about it now. I've already decided that if we do have another, I'm not finding out the sex until birth. The second I lay my eyes on the baby, there will be no disappointments or regrets, because I STILL feel guilty for crying when we found out Bran was a boy. I love my two boys. If I'm not meant to have another daughter, so be it. It will be a big disappointment in my life, but it's not going to crush me. I just want another baby. Jason always said when we hit 30, we're finished. He'll be 29 this year, and I'll turn 27. That time is getting close, and I just can't comprehend that our family is complete yet... We use natural family planning, I've never been on birth control  so I guess it works, lol I keep praying and praying for an accident though!
I'm sorry. I didn't mean to hijack your post, but I just wanted to let you know that I feel the same way. IF Jason was for it, I'd do all that I could for another baby right now. I've never wanted something so much in my life, and I've never been one to be envious of my friends. This wanting a baby IS starting to affect my friendships and my life though. I'm actually starting to resent Jason, because this is really the ONLY thing I have asked him for in our 7 years of marriage. I don't get presents at Christmas, birthdays, etc... It doesn't bother me. I've always just wanted the basics I need to get by with, and to stay home with my babies. That's the best gift that he's given me or ever will give me. I'm a very low maintenance wife. He and our sons are the ones who gets the toys. It's actually starting to make me angry at him. He pretty much gets anything and everything he wants, I don't complain at all. This is the only thing I've really ever wanted or asked him for. It's scary in a way, because nothing has ever had this much of a pull on me, and it doesn't make any sense to me. My head keeps fighting my heart about it (it's so easy now that they're older, they're sleeping all night, we're out of diapers, no worries about major medical problems, no formula to buy, cheaper to put 2 through college than it is 3, etc...), but my heart is definitely winning the battle. Anyway, good luck to you with your decision. |
JakobandBrandonsmom wrote: ....I want my little girl that was given to me and taken away. My entire life, I saw myself as a mother of a daughter. I want the memories I had with my mom to share with her.... My SIL and I both had wonderful relationships with our mothers. They were our moms and bestfriends so I know what you mean. BUT, even having a daughter at birth doesn't guarentee that same relationship. My SIL and her daughter were close while she was young. BUT, as a teen she got into drugs, stole money from mom and dad, left the state with her boyfriend, got pregnant, came home telling mom and dad that EITHER you take the kid or I'm giving it up. Well, grandma and grandpa became the proud owners of a new baby, while their daughter continued the fight with drugs. Later she married, became pregnant again, and kept that child. Now grandma has one and she has the other. This was not what grandma wanted or expected when she gave birth to her daughter, but its the life her daughter has given her. JakobandBrandonsmom wrote: ......There's just someone missing. ...However, I have accepted what happened. I'm finally at peace with it. As happy as they make me, they just don't fill that empty spot I'm feeling though... Please don't take this wrong, but you haven't accepted it and you're not at peace. You're boys have kept you busy enough that you haven't had the "time" to "think" about things. Now that they're getting older and doing more for themselves your mind is not preoccupied, allowing it to bring back painful memories. Your husbands right. No matter how many kids you have you'll have that void. But, talking about it, facing the hurt and anger you feel because of it will allow you to find peace. It'll never be completely gone, but better. Your sons or any other child will never fill that empty spot, it was reserved for that "one and only". JakobandBrandonsmom wrote: ....Jason was always the one who wanted our babies. I wanted to wait until I finished college.... Maybe its time to think about furthering your education. JakobandBrandonsmom wrote: ....Everyone wants one but Jason. He said we've been through enough, and he's not chancing it again.... Have you thought about his "empty spot". He's probably still dealing with this too, but only in a different way. JakobandBrandonsmom wrote: ......It's scary in a way.......My head keeps fighting my heart about it (it's so easy now that they're older, they're sleeping all night, we're out of diapers, no worries about major medical problems, no formula to buy, cheaper to put 2 through college than it is 3, etc...), but my heart is definitely winning the battle....
Read your second quote. I hope you're not upset with me, jmop, but I know death can cause great pain and its easier to bury it than to face it. God bless. |
JakobandBrandonsmom wrote: ((((BIG HUGS)))) I remember that we had our miscarriages around the same time, and I know it still hurts. I still sometimes think, "Wow, I should have a 6 month old. I wonder how different our life would be?" I'm really wanting another baby also.
In my heart, I just don't think we're finished. There's just someone missing. As happy as they make me, they just don't fill that empty spot I'm feeling though. I've also had 3 c-sections since I can only have c-sections. That was a worry too. He said we've been through enough, and he's not chancing it again. So, after this long post, if you feel in your heart that you want another, I say go for it. It won't be easy, but it sounds like you really want another. Like I said, after all of that, I shouldn't want another. I do though. Jason always said when we hit 30, we're finished. He'll be 29 this year, and I'll turn 27. That time is getting close, and I just can't comprehend that our family is complete yet... We use natural family planning, I've never been on birth control so I guess it works, lol I keep praying and praying for an accident though!I'm sorry. I didn't mean to hijack your post, but I just wanted to let you know that I feel the same way. This wanting a baby IS starting to affect my friendships and my life though. I'm actually starting to resent Jason, because this is really the ONLY thing I have asked him for in our 7 years of marriage. I don't get presents at Christmas, birthdays, etc... It doesn't bother me. I've always just wanted the basics I need to get by with, and to stay home with my babies. That's the best gift that he's given me or ever will give me. I'm a very low maintenance wife. It's scary in a way, because nothing has ever had this much of a pull on me, and it doesn't make any sense to me. My head keeps fighting my heart about it (it's so easy now that they're older, they're sleeping all night, we're out of diapers, no worries about major medical problems, no formula to buy, cheaper to put 2 through college than it is 3, etc...), but my heart is definitely winning the battle. Thanks Gail, you do get me, everything you said is exactly the struggle I've been fighting within me. I too feel I should have a 7 mth right now, watching them crawling, about now. It's been so hard to let go, and get past it all. Before I was living with a regret of tying the tubes, and can't untie them I was accepting of my decision. But to get pregnant out of the blue like we did...seriously had an impact on me. I can be logical all I want, about the same things, 2 for college vs...diapers, formula...all that stuff is costly. I don't think we'd ever be a family that ends up in different places, I am positive we'd be tight forever...both of our families all live within a 4 hour drive, most within 2 hours...no one wants to be far away. But yeah my heart keeps wanting another...and that's the hardest thing to ignore. Gail I hope you find peace, and have another, you are still young and have plenty of time. I had the same thought that 30 was the magical age to stop, but now I'm 33...and feel no different. Still very healthy, and perhaps in a better place to have more. I can't imagine having Rob gone for periods of time tho, he is home every night before 6 pm, and we share all parenting duties. Good luck, and I tried all family planning techiniques too, but my tube is just not open enough. thanks for sharing, and I am glad we feel the same way. |
| I am sorry too for your miscarriage. My youngest son was a twin, lost one early and had him. He is a strong and healthy 18 year old now and I did not have anymore after that. I have two lovely sons and blessed to be able to have them. Yes I still sometimes think about the lost twin, what he/she might of looked like, what he/she might of been in life, but it does get easier as time goes by.
My sister could not have children, she went through 5 IVF tries and it nearly broke up the marriage. It was not the financial side it was the great emotional rollercoaster ride that happens when going through IVF. The anticipation, & then the huge disappointment when it does not work. She got pregnant on one of the tries but lost it early, that was even more emotional and trying on the marriage then not taking at all. She is too old now as there is a stop date here for IVF of 42. Her marriage is OK now but at the time so much stress, emotions and disappointment that can come with it and you really do have to be strong as a couple to get through it all. Me well I am looking to satisfy my maternal instincts when my kids have children, grandma YAY and I am going to spoil them rotten then hand them back That will fill my empty spot in the future |
| Definitely some things to think about, Mouthy.
Oh, and I did finish school with double majors (geosciences and communications). I would have went back regardless, but I started back up the summer after Kayla passed away. I finished 9 months pregnant with Jakob, barely made it out! lol Considering how much I STILL owe student loan companies right now, I'm not sure I want to go back. Besides, Jason is in college full-time right now also, so most of our spare money is going towards his degree. Thank goodness his GI Bill takes care of most of his tuition though. |
| Daisie--I'm sorry for all your heartache. The first thing that has struck me in this dialogue is that you said that you want the baby and your husband doesn't. I think that's a big deal, something that shouldn't be ignored, especially since there will be considerable effort and money that will have to go into having the baby.
I have 2 brothers, one older by 18 months and one younger by 2 years (to the day!). I also have a half brother and half sister who are 13 and 8 years old than me, so we have never been close, but are becoming a little closer as we get older. There were some things that I liked about having my brothers around, but there were also times I wished I was an only child (all kids do!). I think your kids would be perfectly happy to just be the 2 of them, without having more siblings around. I don't feel lonely because I don't have a sister (my mom always said she wanted a 4th and wanted it to be a girl)...but then I would have had to share my mom's attention with another girl. I think the only thing that staved off 'the middle child syndrome' with me was that I was the only girl. I think I would have resented another 'rival.' We also didn't have a lot of money while growing up and I think that if I had known if there were fewer children that we would have had a better life, financially-speaking I might be resentful of my parents (not that I would have wished those kids weren't there). Not that money brings happiness, but there is something to be said for being able to have Christmas and birthday presents and go on vacation, etc. Good luck with your decision...it'll work out, whatever happens. |
| Thanks Bosley's mom, I am hoping to find peace with it, somehow.
For example yesterday we spent the day with the kids...as we do everyday, but anyways...
First it was swimming lessons, then straight to skating lessons...now in moments like this you appreciate not having a toddler. Then we came home and proceeded to get ready for a movie, it was toss up between Curious George and Shaggy Dog...after reading the horrible reviews on Shaggy Dog we chose CG. Kids loved it, we liked it, sweet movie. Babies don't belong at the movies, we tried once with Madelyn...it was okay but I missed alot of the movie. Then it was a dinner out at Chili's...we could have had a baby with us there, and I was imagining a high chair pulled up to the table. But not twins...a risk with invitro. So you see I am trying so hard to picture the changes my family would have to go through to accommodate another child. It is purely selfish on my part, and I do acknowledge that. Hubby spends alot of time with these kids, playing, reading...they LOVE daddy time. I am no longer needed, and they chose to go to him and not me. It's a hard thing to be left out, so I want to feel something again, I want the baby so much, and have something to enjoy as well. I also think the kids will learn some valuable lessons that are muchly needed, about patience, and sharing, and tolerance...sure they can find that in other areas. As well as the other things I mentioned. Hubby is no longer saying no to 100%....he's willing to go to the appt and hear what they have to say, and ask us. Other points: a)Vacations...we don't take any, we like to go camping. Babies love camping too..at least our's did, we had some of the best times. b)Lessons...by the time this baby is ready, these two could be done....no sacrifice really. c)Eating out...on occassion, we do more eating in or drive thru...again we are homebody's. d)Clothes...I am able to shop for new things at a great price, or find the gems in second hand. Knowing we have family ready to pass things to me this time, I will totally accept them. I was the hand downer since my kids are older than everyone else's. e) vehicle and house can stay the same, we do not need to upgrade or downsize...unless we feel a 5 bedroom older home would be better or a van....it would be comparable value if we sold our home. When we got married my ideal family size was 4 children, stopping at two has left me empty. Having the misscarriage just solidified that feeling for me. I do not feel finished, and I want to be selfish and have another. However I will not jeopardize my marriage over it, if hubby can't come on board with this, we won't be doing it. I just want him to consider all aspects...not just cost of diapers and formula, but the giggles, their insatiable curiousity, and all the fun we had with the first two, the firsts...steps, smiles, words, first day of school again, love they give you with their tiny hugs....the joy these two have brought us, and that adding another will not be a hardship but another blessing we can all enjoy. Of course I am not blind to memories of vomit, and diarreha out the diaper without a change of clothes, those first sleepless nights, the pain of the c-sec, the food refusal's...throwing food across the room, emptying my closet's for the 100th time, sickness in the night and not sure if it requires an emergancy room visit....but I can handle all that better now. Now I can take it all instride. We are NOT getting another puppy, infact the problems we've had in the past is because I thought this dog will fill the void. We've been through a few dogs, and only Remy has survived..she truly has been a blessing for me. I see her as a dog, a family pet...not a baby replacer like all the others. |
Daisie wrote: ......So you see I am trying so hard to picture the changes my family would have to go through to accommodate another child. It is purely selfish on my part, and I do acknowledge that Please believe me when I say I mean no disrespect, my intent is not to offend you, only to give you other things to think about before you make you're final decision, although it seems you already have. The changes your family would go through would not be to accommodate a new baby, it would be to accommodate "you," as illistrated in your next quote. Daisie wrote: .....they LOVE daddy time. I am no longer needed, and they chose to go to him and not me. It's a hard thing to be left out, so I want to feel something again, I want the baby so much, and have something to enjoy as well. This child will also only need you for so long. Its a natural thing for children to pick their "favorite" parent for the day, week or month. Perhaps they sense your depression and your mood makes you less fun than "daddy" right now. They swing back and forth. You should enjoy the daddy/child time, you should treat yourself to some rest or extra cleaning, shopping or whatever while they're preoccuppied. As a matter of fact there are a lot of women that wish "daddy" would spend more time with the kids. Daisie wrote: ......I also think the kids will learn some valuable lessons that are muchly needed, about patience, and sharing, and tolerance...sure they can find that in other areas. Here's where I insert foot in mouth. Hon, you don't have babies in order to teach your already existing kids lessons. I know you know that. But, what I don't think you realize is "why" those lessons in patience, sharing and tolerance may seem necessary. From your posts, including this one with you admitting you're being selfish, I think perhaps you're so committed to wanting and having this baby become a reality that "you're" unintentionally teaching your boys the opposite of the lesson that you are wanting to teach them. We forget very easily and often that "they (are kids) are watching and listening" to eveything we say and do, and learn from our example. Daisie wrote: ......When we got married my ideal family size was 4 children, stopping at two has left me empty. Having the misscarriage just solidified that feeling for me. I do not feel finished, and I want to be selfish and have another. However I will not jeopardize my marriage over it, if hubby can't come on board with this, we won't be doing it. I just want him to consider all aspects...not just...........
In the above quote, you mention the words "I", "me" and "my" seven times, the word "we" two times, and the words, "him" and "hubby" two times. I'm sorry but I feel that you need to talk to someone about your miscarriage. I'm sooooooo sorry for your loss, but hon, you're losing out on precious time with your hubby and your little ones during this difficult time for you. I is not family, I is not sharing. "Eye" is looking out for the family you have, teaching them to tolerate one another for who they are, regardless of differances. Eye is seeing when we're thinking of only ourselves and allowing others to suffer because of it. Please, I mean no harm, but I feel that in spite of the love you so apparantly have and show for your family that you are unintentionally painting yourself out of the "family" picture in order to just get what you "think" you want and need. Look long and hard inward, re-visit the places of heartache and pain. Ask yourself what you are "really" searching for and then go forward. Please, don't be offened, I just see soooooo much hurt in you and want so much for you to find happiness, but I don't think a baby is the answer. Not yet. Dig deep, then go after that child with all your might. I'd almost bet your hubby would be as eager as you then to proceed. God bless you all. |
| Daisie,
I have been pregnant 6 times. Out of those 6, 4 were miscarriages. I was so caught up in the fact that I wanted a baby so badly that I immediatley tried to get pregnant again. I don't think I let myself grieve. I think mostly it was just the fact that I couldn't retain a pregnancy that made me want it even more. Then all my friends started getting pregnant and they weren't even trying. 
I finally got pregnant...after my second miscarriage...with Ryan. Since getting pregnant was all I was concerned about I failed to see what was going on with my husband. He wanted to make me happy, because he knew how miserable I was. He was not ready for a child and failed to tell me that. This was Ryan's Dad... As Ryan got to about 10 month old we could tell that things were not as they should have been. After Ryan was diagnosed with his problems things just got much, much worse and my marriage ended. Billy and I decided we wanted kids and I had gotten my IUD taken out for medical reasons. (I had an Ovarian Cyst burst and the Dr said I needed a BC with hormones to prevent further ones...since I would also have to go on the pill, no point in double protection so I had the IUD taken out.) The pill did not agree with me, probably too much hormones and I stopped the pill. I figured if I got pregnant it would be great....because Billy & I wanted to have a baby. We were not technically trying when I got pregnant the first time. I found out I was pregnant and was so excited. Billy came home that day and he had told me earlier that he was coming home with an early christmas present. I waited very unpatiently for him to get home so I could give him the news. He walked in the door and I ran to him and said "Where's my present?" Just so I could get that out of the way to give him his news. He pulled a Diamond Ring and proposed.... I didn't even answer his question. I just blurted out that I was pregnant. lol I miscarried at 13 weeks and had to have a D & C. Losing my third now.....got me. It wasn't as bad as the first two. I think because I now already had a child. We decided to give my body time to heal and use birth control for the next three months. Billy & I got married and three days after we got back from Vegas where we got married I found out I was pregnant again. I refused to tell anyone...besides Billy. I ended up miscarrying very early into the pregnancy. Just 1 week after my missed period. We had just found out that we had to move and then a deal on the house we wanted fell through...we had 30 days to move and no house. A very stressful time. Two weeks later everything finally calmed down. We had a house to move to and everything started going smoothly again. With all the drama of packing up the house and everything I was not thinking about getting pregnant. About a week after we moved I realized that I was late. I immediatley went to the OB and by this point I expected to miscarry. I had ultrasounds from 6 weeks until 13 weeks. I was almost shocked everytime I saw a beating heart. I had to be on hormones too since my progesterone levels were too low to retain the pregnancy. Hayley was born in Jan 2005. Daisie, I know you want more kids, but I think miscarrying just increases that because you lost something. Somethings to consider.... Even with invitro you could miscarry again. You need to be prepared for that and also be prepared if it doesn't work at all. If hubby does not want more it could lead to marital problems. A third sibling could really turn the house upside down. Your other kids could have been perfect babies and the next could be the complete opposite. I would never wish this upon anyone, but there is always a posibility that a child could have problems like Ryan does....which makes life REALLY tough. Ryan was 6 when I got pregnant with Hayley. I don't think age difference is bad at all. Ryan needed me so much that I couldn't even think about having another until I did. Ryan wasn't completely out diapers until he was 5 yrs old.
Ulimately the decision is up to you. I do think you need to really talk to hubby about the way you are feeling. I hope you make the best decision for you and your family. I hope I helped a little  |
| Mouthy...no offense at all, I really appreciate your thoughts. I am the first to admit how selfish I feel, and I shouldn't my wants above the others, esp my hubby's.
Ellissa, I had no idea you went through so much. I know how much you loved having Haley, she is a real sweetie. I can't be 100% sure everything will work out, but I am confident it should be healthy, and in the end very wanted like the first two. My misscarriage was a result of my tube being tied...even tho it was open enough to let an agg get through, there wasn't enough tube left to develop the baby...what my obgyn said. Having the invirto will bypass everything, and the only thing I have to worry about is implanatation. With invitro you can have a genetic screening as well, so we don't have to risk having a disabled child. But hubby and I are very healthy, and have no family history's of problems. I will do alot of digging, and I am even considering couselling if needed...I've never done that before but sometimes I just can't get all the feelings figured out. Anyways everyone has made some really good points for me to consider. I still want to have another baby, and I suppose that may never go away. Hubby and I have talked he knows what I feel, he knows how selfish I really am, he wants to make me happy too, and I have told him in a nice way that if he makes a decision he has say it with conviction...if he wants me to respect his decision, and I feel he has honeslty heard me...then I will not push this issue. He often says yes but then is being passive agressive about it...I will not live with that over my head. So he know if he says "yes", then he needs to mean it, and embrace this with me. If he says "no", then I will need to accept it, and try my hardest to fill the void with something else...that I love to do. I have until March 22 to come to terms with all of this, and see what the specialist has to say. |
| Daisie,
After my second miscarriage, they performed testing on the fetus and found a genetic disorder was the reason for my miscarriage. My ex-husband and I then had genetic testing done. Turns out that the baby had a genetic disorder that my ex had. He had a Chromosomal mix up, but if it is mixed up in a even way you can live...like my ex. Our babies chromosomes where uneven.. It was called an unbalanced translocation of chromosomes...so there was a chance I could have carried full term and the baby would have died right after being born. The Dr's said there was only a 5% chance of passing this disorder on. So we tried again and I got pregnant with Ryan. I had an Amnio done because my GP said he didn't think I could handle having a baby with problems. The Amnio came back with everything being normal. Again after he was born we had a full genetic work up on him. Everything came back normal. So Ryan's problems are not genetic. He has a cyst on his brain, had infantile autisim, autisim spectrum disorder (means he has some autistic tendencies, but not enough to be diagnosed as Autistic.)... severe developmental delays and didn't walk or talk until 3 1/2 yrs old. Sometimes things happen.... I believe that luck was on my side with Hayley. I would not try to have another baby even if I wanted one. I was a complete nervous wreck during her pregnancy. MY OB said I shouldn't be worried because it was ex-hubby that had problems and could have caused Ryans.... But I explained that was not the case being that Ryan did not have the genetic disorder that he had. Though maybe some factors with that led to the problems... Who knows.. All I know is in my case....even though I would love to give Billy another child... I am way too scared to chance it. Hayley is perfect. If I had to deal with two like Ryan I would probably go insane. I am on anti-depressants to help me deal with him. Also I have a Fibromyalgia and carrying Hayley around everywhere has really done a number on my body. I am only supposed to carry at the most 5 lbs for 5 minutes at a time. I don't want to tempt fate. Just wanted to let you know that Genetic testing will just tell you about genetic problems. I am not trying to scare you...just explaining why I am done having kids. |
| Ellissa, I am so glad you have a wonderful husband and beautiful daughter, and having a child with a disability takes alot of stength and courgage...I am so impressed to see people everyday be able to cope and find it within to keep going. You should be very proud, and sending you some big hugs.
I also know life gives no gaurantees, just knowing what my neighbours went though last year, shook me up. She also has a child 2 1/2 yrs old that has a major disability, and they got pregnant again. This time the tests should it was a boy, no problems and he was healthy...then 1 mth before his due date, she went into labour and delivered in her home, and he was dead. The cord developed a knot and he died in the womb. She is thankful her teenage daughter from a previous relationship is very healthy and a good child...she babysits for us and watches the dogs too. Anyways I learned of a new procedure, that requires very little drugs, and they take a mature egg follicle and AI it, and implant as you go through a normal cycle...very much like the original test tube baby was done...but with better medical advances. I am going to see if I am a candidate for that...it is 2/3 rds less than regular invitro, and I would only get one baby, with the opportunity to try every cycle. I have a healthy womb, no fertility deficences etc...so this is suited to me. I'll let you know how it goes, and what we decided. Hubby agreed to go to the appt. So that is something...he had the option to say no. |
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