SOS - has Sheba been spayed-or not?
So they are my questions. Is it even remotely possible that a spayed dog would swell and bleed like that? Is there a pill or something they can give her to abort a pregnancy, if she's pregnant. If not what are my other options? How will I know if she's pregnant? And am I a total idiot? |
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| I just got Rags who was a rescue and also supposed to be spayed....
Sure enough when I took her to the Vet, the Vet said she was very much in heat with major swelling. I just had her spayed today. If she is bleeding she is most likely in heat and not yet pregnant. I would get her to the Vet asap to avoid an unwanted pregnant... Could also be why she has been a pain in the butt... |
| If she is bleeding and swollen, yes she is in heat. If Barkley mounted her, then yes she is pregnant now most likely. I would take her in and get her spayed asap before it's too far along. |
| Holy Crap!! I say absolutely this has been the cause for her erratic aggressive behavior.
The couple of weaks leading into ovulation time a female dog can be overly protective of her space. I am sure this is what was happening when they were playing. Barkley got a little close to her back side and she wasn't having it!! Rebecca almost took off Frank's nose during the time when she started her heat cycle. Blood was drawn & everything. Fortunately I was able to talk to the breeder who walked me through what would happen during the whole heat cycle. The good news is after she is spayed she will be a completely different girl without those hormones raging around a male. How sad for poor Sheba. Was she doing a lot of licking around her area the last couple of weeks? Some dogs are very clean about it and don't leave a lot of blood around. Now that they've coppulated be wary of Sheba being in a protective state again. I'm very sorry you're in this situation. I hope you change your mind about keeping her - I'm sure she will be an entirely different dog once she's spayed - I was really upset about Rebecca snapping at Frank the way she did as all he would do is walk into the same room we were in and being in heat was truly the cause. I hope other people who have experienced this male/female hormone behavior will chime in to confirm what you've been experiencing. Poor Sheba & poor Barkley. Barkley is still a pup too so he probably didn't show the typical signs that a stud dog would do. I definately can sympathize with what you have been going through. |
| Let's all take a deep breath.
Deonarine, when you say "mounted" what exactly do you mean? If Barkley was on top of her and humping, that is not going to get her pregnant. If he was on top of her, entered, then the two of them were stuck together standing there. back-to-back, so to speak, for about 10 minutes, then there is a chance of pregnancy. Not sure if the following will pass the edits, but here goes.....They need to be locked for the sperm to flow into the uturus. There is a ball that forms on the dog's penis that keeps it inside, while all is flowing into her, so it is practically impossible to separate them...or it will be painful, and might cause injury. This all takes time, so was there time for this to happen? |
| Actually, there doesn't "need" to be an actual tie for pregnancy to occur...
A dog ejaculates in a matters of seconds, whether there is a tie or not. |
| Well they had more than seconds, but they weren't stuck together. I'm going to try to get Sheba in to see someone when I get off work today. I just can't miss another day of work this week. |
VerveUp wrote: "Was she doing a lot of licking around her area the last couple of weeks? Some dogs are very clean about it and don't leave a lot of blood around"
Yes she was--I just thought it was because she was in a new environment and nervous. Barkley was also doing a lot of sniffing, but I put that down to the fact that I brougt a strange dog into the house. I feel like a complete moron for not picking up on this sooner. It never crossed my mind to think that they were wrong, and she had not been spayed. |
deograine wrote: It never crossed my mind to think that they were wrong, and she had not been spayed.
Don't feel bad about not knowing. Unless you have experienced it before, how would you know what was happening? Especially since they told you she was spayed. I guess they didn't even bother to look for a scar? I didn't know what was going on with Rebecca snapping at Frank because she wasn't supposed to go into heat for a couple months after she came to live with us. I thought she was being horrible with Frank and I was ready to give her back too. But there was blood left behind and I was like "Eureka". I'm just glad I had the breeder to talk about each step of the heat cycle and it was like clockwork what was going on. |
| my brother adopted a rescue cat, which he had been told was spayed, and she ended up not being...so mistakes can be made. |
| Rags has gotten quite a bit crazy in the past couple of weeks. She was fine with Pepsi, but tried to eat Peanut when he was trying to hump her. She also made him crazy with trying to sniff him. Then for the past week she's been barking and attacking her area. I believe her hormones had the other dogs a little nuts too.
Like my SIL says there is a reason they are called bitches.....lol |
| Isn't there an estrogen injection that can be given to prolong the season and prevent the fetus' from implanting on the uterus wall? Seems to me we did that when a cocky cocker spaniel fence jumper got to our Siberian.
Let's not rule out an infection such as a bladder........outside chance. If vet's don't clearly see a scar, they feel. That's a 50/50 at best. Spay during heat is more expensive as it is dangerous.......a lot more blood in the area. But since she might have been bred, it's the vet's call. Hopefully all goes well as she turns out to be a sweet girl after all. |
| I called my vet, but they can't see her until tommorow. So I also called the vet located in petsmart. My vet says they will do the spay, but they discourage it because of increased complications and confirmed that it is more expensive because it is a more complicated procedure on females in heat. She said they do not offer any kind of injection or medication to terminate a preganancy. The vets at petsmart say they will not perform a spay on a female in heat and they also don't offer any kind of injection or medication to terminate a preganancy. I'm still checking. I contacted Cynthia and told her what was going on. She said that when they picked her up from the shelter the shelter had her listed as spayed. Nobody ever noticed anything so no one thought anything about it. She offered to pay for the injection or medication and vet visit to ensure there would be no puppies. I'm still checking with vets in the area. |
And you know how I kept saying I didn't know anything about dogs and this was all new to me--well I think the universe decided to give me an all at once crash course!  |
| I remember our vet was a country vet. When I asked my urban vet several years later he laughed at me like I was insane.
A little research and this is what I came up with, " Injections of hormones may be given by your veterinarian to produce an abortion in a female if you do not care about her future reproductive abilities. Another (Dexamethasone) may be given as late as 45 days into the pregnancy. The problem with these injections is they come with a high incidence of pyometra. ... These injections may cause bone marrow suppression....etc. So vets have caused chemical abortions in the past, but perhaps the thinking now is it is just too risky for the bitch. Younger vets may not have heard about the practice so that's why they treat us like we are insane. Let's hope since there wasn't a tie, this "mating" will not be successful...what, a little foreplay?? Also let's hope this was the only time they engaged in such activities  |
| Also from Merck manual:
Precise induction of parturition in the bitch and queen is not presently possible. Further, a routinely safe and efficacious abortifacient has yet to be developed. After day 40 of pregnancy, prostaglandin (PG) F2α at ~10 µg/kg, t.i.d. for 2 days, has induced abortion in ~60% of treated bitches. Cats pregnant ≥40 days can be aborted with PGF2α at 0.5-1 mg/kg, daily for 2 days, provided they have been “stressed” or are pretreated with adrenocorticotropic hormone. Higher doses have many undesirable side effects. Dexamethasone has resulted in intrauterine fetal death and resorption when given to bitches at 0.5 mg/kg, IM, b.i.d. for 10 days. The same treatment after day 45 resulted in abortion. The effect of dexamethasone on cats has not been reported. |
| I talked to the vet and she says she will spay Sheba as soon as she is out of heat. If there is a pregnancy it will be early enough that it won't present any problems.
I also decided tonight that I can't really judge Sheba's behavior based on the last few weeks. It would not be a fair assessment. I talked with Cynthia and she agreed. I'm giving it a few more weeks. I went out and bought The Dog Whisperer: A Compassionate, Nonviolent Approach to Dog Training, by Paul Owens, Norma Eckroate that many of you have recommended, and a few other books because I am a bookaholic. We'll wait and see how it goes! |
| Did you get
The Dog Whisperer: A Compassionate, Nonviolent Approach to Dog Training, by Paul Owens, Norma Eckroate or The Dog Listener: Learn How to Communicate with Your Dog for Willing Cooperation, by Jan Fennell? |
| The one by Paul Owen is excellant. |
| The Paul Owen Book,
I also picked up these: How to Speak Dog--Stanley Coren How Dogs Think--Stanley Coren Bones Would Rain From the Sky--Suzanne Clothier I figured with Sheba I am going to need a crash course  |
| Good luck with Sheba! |
Quote: How to Speak Dog--Stanley Coren
How Dogs Think--Stanley Coren Bones Would Rain From the Sky--Suzanne Clothier Personally I am not a big fan of Stanley Coren. He has some good stuff, but still a bit old-fashioned, IMO. Suzanne Clothier- I have the same book. Very touchy, feely, with some good points and stories. I like more meat in the books I read, but for folks interested in getting "in tune" with the animals, it is great. I love hearing about people getting thier dog book library up-to-date. 5 years ago I had none. Now I have about 8-10 great books, but then I lend them out and forget to who....  |
 Best wishes with your decision to give Sheba a few more weeks. Let's hope that she is happier after her surgery. Raging hormones cause havok for girls of every species! |
| Wow...this would explain alot! What a crazy ride you and Sheba have been on! So is it certain she wasn't spayed? Or will you find out for sure when you take her to the vet?
Good for you for holding on a little longer!  This really would make sense with all of her behavior problems...wouldn't it? 
I'm dying to hear the end of this story! I think it's going to be a happy ending!!!! |
| Me too, best wishes with sheba deograine and I am keeping fingers and the girls their paws crossed that spaying will help her big time in improvement in her nature. Let's hope that is what her behaviour problems stem from |
| Good luck with Sheba - what a way to find out about the spay (or lack thereof)! |
| Hi,
Thanks for hanging in there Deeograine and giving Sheba another chance!! You are an angel !!!! Marianne and the boys |
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