I Just Don't Get It - Grooming a Sheepdogs Tail Area
I know this subject has been discussed before but I was unable to find the thread. I need to learn how to groom Fred's butt so it does not look like a Baboon's butt. I usually do minimal trimming on Fred except for the under ear area, shaping his feet and trimming around the tail area and the anal area. This time I thought I would try shaping his back area like they do with the "show dogs". Well Fred's butt looks like a baboon's. If anyone can give me simple directions in what to do I would be grateful, and so would Fred. Not sure whether scissors are used in shaping or if clippers are used. I used scissors on Fred. Also please let me know the length the hair in that area is usually left and how large of an area is trimmed. I am going to attend the Phila/NJ picnic and I am hoping there will be a grooming lesson ...............but until then. Thanks in advance from both Fred and myself. Jack |
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| Without having an OES mentor nearby to help you, the best advice I can offer is to try and find show dog pics and trim your dog accordingly. I'm still in the show dog trimming learing phase but I do Frank's with long scissors. The trick is basically to try and make it all look flat from like the top of his rear down. You don't want to trim the "skirt" where basically the testicles would be because it's important to keep that whole area wide including the hocks. And just so you have length ratio, Frank's coat overall is about 7" long and his backside is trimmed to about 2".
If I hadn't just hosed his backside due to diarrhea I would snap a photo for you but maby I can do that for you later this week. |
| Freds back, take your hand and place it on his withers, expand your hand fully from there down his back where your fingers end that is where you start trimming, bring up a layer either side (verticle) of his back using just a tad of hairspray brush up a thin layer so that you have a line of hair there from the middle of his back to his rump, sort of like a punk rocker hairdo. Take some curved scissors, and starting at the rump tip the ends in sort of a half circle (arc) ending about a handspand from the withers at the other end.
Bring up another layer either side, spray to hold it there and repeat the process, so on and so on and gradually grade it down either side of the first initial trim. Only do about 1/4 inch taking the tufts off each time, that way with pratice you are not cutting too much off if you make a mistake. The back side, brush coat up and forward over the back from the core (tail stump) bring down a little over the core and trim with scissors to about 1 " just a small layer, not going to far either side of the core. Gentley brush down another thin layer and trim to match where you initially did the first trim, continue bringing down the layers with each layer getting slightly longer then the next and gradually grade the scissoring into what has been trimmed across his back. Don't go too far with up with the bottom trim from the core. Under the core take some thinning shears and snip off tufts and grade underneath the core into place, thinning shears are great as they don't show scissor cuts. Stand the dog and look at him from the side, brush all the coat from the thigh area up & outwards over the bottom and thigh area, any tufts sticking out at the side just follow the line of the dogs rump and thigh just snip off tufts again with thinning shears and grade in gradually. Bit hard to explain but get a pciture of a dog in show trim and that will help enormously with following outlines and where to trim. I have a great book with diagrams and what scissors to use where but it is copyrighted so can't post it  Hope this give you some help with trimming fred. 
lisaoes |
| Great instructions, Lisa! Here's some good pics if this will help, from the OESCA web site... http://www.oldenglishsheepdogclubofamer ... efault.htm under the "hindquarters" tab.
Nita |
| Here is two photos of basic trimming of an OES, brie was trimmed the day before these photos were taken so you can see the lines over the back coat and where to trim that I was talking about.
Scissors needed, 1 pair long shank scissors 1 pair of curved scissors (great for feet too) 1 pair thinning shears, I use the single bladed ones rather then the double ones. Investing in good quality scissors then you basically have them forever. 
This photo shows a bit more of the backside and you can see where above the core and below the core the hair is graded in, also the shape of the top thigh area and bottom following the line of the dog when trimming that area, it is taken up and out the opposite direction and tipped following the contour of the dog, but only from half way up the back of the leg to the rump, then brushed forward over the thigh and side area again. 
Hope these images help in getting an idea of trimming, it is great to have ago and learn, make a mistake and it grows and you can try again. The only way to learn is to do it!! |
| ive been trying to do the shaping of boo rear end but i cant seem to quite get it can someone post a picture of the rear end without it being in the show pose just it all lying down to see if this helps thank you it would be helpful. |
| Thanks all for the helpful information. I can see that the trimming is not for a novice. I must say that you all have beautiful dogs. |
| Lisa, can you post the title and author of that book? Even if it's not in print anymore, we may be able to find it elsewhere.
And, don't forget, it's hair, it grows back. Trim away!!!!! |
| "The Care and Grooming of Old English Sheepdogs" by Monique Carrie're.
Published by " Best Read Books Ltd, 444 Pleasant Park Road, Ottawa, Ontario, Canada. K1H 5N1." |
| jackcjjc and anyone else interested in trimming your own dog.
Good trimming tools such as scissors can be very expensive. I have always trimmed my own dogs but I had to learn because I was showing. If you don't have curved scissors then straight ones will do. It's just all a matter of practice and what you get used to. I have curved scissors but I never use them. You may of course find them easier to use. I have always used my straight ones. I know that most show people use the curved scissors and I was also told that I should have them, but I didn't buy a pair for quite a long time and then when I did I preferred my straight ones anyway. If you are trimming a pet it's not necessary to buy the most expensive - not because your dog isn't worth it, but because you wouldn't be trimming nearly as often.
I also have the book which Lisa has recommended and I also recommend it. |
| lisa -how do you make the back coat all poofy like that?!! |
The Monique Carriere book has been recommended to me by several people. Everywhere I've looked says it's "not available", "out of print" or "try somewhere else". I've checked the publisher, Amazon.com, the Canadian Kennel Club and even e-mailed a dog show supply store in Australia. No luck. Does anyone know of a source for this book?  |
london wrote: lisa -how do you make the back coat all poofy like that?!!
It's the trimming, takes all the whispy ends off the coat and thickens it up with regular tipping and makes it puffier
I will see if there is any of the books available here still I know it has been out of print, so maybe a 2nd hand book shop? |
| London: A lot also depends on the thickness of the dog's coat. If your dog has a very thick dense coat the hair will almost stand up on its own. The secret is not to have the coat too long on top of the rump. If the coat is not so dense then back combing/brushing is needed to help it stand up and make it look thicker. |
| Beautiful pics, and excellent instructions. I'm going to be trimming Sky by myself for the first time this week, maybe I'll post pics if I don't mess it up too badly. LOL
I've always had mentors trim them for me before a show, but this time no one is going to be close enough. LOL |
| Yay, go for it stacey, love to see a piccy of Sky when you have done her.
Best wishes also for the shows  |
| Good on you Willowsprite. The only way to learn is to do it yourself. Don't forget that if you make a mistake it doesn't matter 'cause the coat grows back again very quickly.
I remember once cutting a 'hole' in the front on Penny's front paw. I nearly died when I saw what I had done  but it grew back again quickly and I was able to tease it a little so that it wasn't noticable. 
When I've been asked to trim I always say 'watch what I am doing so that you can do it yourslef'. Practice makes perfect - or so they say. |
My next door neighbor has a poodle, jack...she helped me the first time too...Still not great at it, but like Jess said.."it grows back quickly"...I shaved half of pandas face without the guard on...and she ended up looking like a poodle........  |
I'm not sure, but maybe this can be to some help for you
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Great diagrams, Tove! Thank you so much  Working to get Nelson's coat shaped up and this will be a great guide for us.
Nita |
| Wonderful diagrams. Do you think you could start a new post so they don't get lost in the shuffle. And maybe Ron could please make it a sticky as well as Carl's line brushing post? Thank you! |
| Tove the diagrams are just wonderful and going to be so helpful for people interested in shaping their sheepie. |
| Tove, Thank you, thank you for the diagram. I am not sure about the narrative on it but the diagram itself gives me a good starting point. Again thank you so much. |
| Tove -
The diagram is really helpful, thanks so much! |
| Great diagrams. |
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