questions about alpha
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Oh, my, Valerie. You will get a lot of opinions here, I think, so good luck sorting through them all 
First of all, the whole alpha theory came out 15 years or so, ago, and has been adopted by many folks as an absolute. Research over the years has tweaked the theory somewhat, and the following are some variations that I have found to be the most modern: The alpha, beta, and omega hierarchy is very fluid, but it is species-exclusive. Humans do not come into play umless we are discussing humans only. The hierarchy is more linear amoung males, while with females it changes all the time. That makes it hard to determine who is in charge at any one time. The dogs decide who is who, and we need to support that role, in order to maintain the status quo. However, that is difficult if it is not blatently obvious. The alpha is normally NOT the vocal, bossy, pushy one. The alpha knows they are alpha, and don't need to prove it to any other dog in the household. The beta is usually the alpha-wanna-be, who tries to be tough, and acts like the boss, but isn't. Young, foolish dogs may fit in here. The submissive omega is at the bottom, and likes it there. An alpha dog in the household may be an omega at the dog park, and vice versa. It all depends on the make-up of the group. So basically, things may change hourly, daily, environmentally, and we do our best to support the pack the way they exist, but again, it is fluid, so we may be kept guessing. Dogs are much more complicated than we'd like them to be  |
| Excellent reply Bosley'sMom....
Honestly I have never paid a lot of attention to that. I just lvoe my dogs, and things go however they go *shrug* There is jealousy, or I guess resource guarding, when I am focused on only one, usually Dancer likes ot hog me to herself and if I am grooming Sky Dancer will dig at the floor, or bark at nothing to get my attention. Abby came into the picture very very submissive and although she has come out of her shell, she is still submissive, and seems content to be that way. |
| That was excellent Bosley's mom!! Well said!!
I couldn't agree with you more. In my household it's very evident that Merlin is the Alpha and has never been challenged for that position. He can eat his bone in a room with the other two dogs present and neither will even go near it ..even if he drops it and walks away. If on the other hand, the other two have a bone..he walks over and they immediately relenquish it to him. If he jumps up on the couch the other two will move out of the way...the world is his oyster in a way. Ironicially he prefers the floor but if he does happen to want the couch ..Panda or Blue will immediately move. No arguements,no challenges..they view him as Alpha and that's it. In a rare instance if they don't drop their bone..he simply just takes it from them and they allow him to do it. Never would that happen the other way around..and if it did I can guarantee they would be a battle. Blue was 13 1/2 and Shaggy 15 when Merlin arrived at the age of 8 wks. Shaggy(she was Alpha) lived another 4 months when he came into the household before she passed. Normally Blue would then have been the next Alpha as he was older and the pre-existing dog in the household (which usually regulates whom is Alpha) and the fact that Merlin was a pup. However, Blue was very passive and when Merlin was only 6 months , Blue tried to put him in his place...Merlin immediately pinned him down and walked away. Not hurting him at all but letting him know..he would not tolerate being in second spot. It happened once more, and from that moment on ..Merlin was alpha. Ideally this was far too young an age for Merlin to take the leadership role, and I tried to give Blue a lot of opportunity to retain his Alpha position..feeding him first..walks with me first..that sort of thing..but he was uncomfortable in the role and always allowed Merlin first choice. The problems I have in my household is Blue aligns himself with Merlin since Panda's arrival and neither Blue or Panda will budge an inch to give up second in command which causes friction. I've had 7 dogs and this is the first time I've had this happen, usually one eventually gives in and becomes omega. Not so in my household as Panda in his love for me will risk everything to sit and be with me..much to Blue's chagrin. Kinda sad to watch so it's why I take each out seperately for one on one time with me and all together other days where each can roam free and everyone is happy. Blue has changed in other ways too as before he was my son's dog and rarely sought my attention. As my son has become older and busier with friends, Blue started getting more attention from me and again I was very suprised in the changes in his behavior. At 15, he now tries to crawl on my lap or craddle in my arms if I'm sitting down..he never did that before! Seems as I'm a trigger too..as both Panda and Blue race around each night to see who gets to sit with me. Merlin rarely vies for this kind of attention. I try to be fair but will often get up if they are both vying for my attention at the same time to difuse any problems. As Blue ages it will become apparent that he will lose his position but perhaps that is why he has aligned himself so strongly with Merlin. As the few times he has attacked Panda (Panda never goes after Blue) Merlin immediately races over and Panda drops his head...no eye contact and leaves. I have no doubt if Blue and Panda were to have an all and all out fight..Panda would be the winner, but as Merlin races over and sides with Blue...Blue remains as second and Panda refuses to be the Omega to him. Intresting too is Merlin never attacks Panda and leaves him alone and only races to protect Blue. When Blue passes I am almost sure that Merlin and Panda will have the equally strong bond that Merlin and Blue now share. They did when Panda first arrived and Old Blue saw his positioning weakening and started at the age of 13 roughhousing and playing with Merlin daily. He had never played in his entire life before that..being more interested in playing ball with humans instead. I can see the Alpha presence too in the way that each climb the stairs to go back in the house if we're out in the backyard. I do this twice daily and every single day..both Panda and Blue wait until Merlin starts to walk up..they wouldn't think to go ahead of him. It has never happened! (I on the other hand always make sure I go up before Merlin) LOL. Same with walks on the leash..Merlin will always inch forward to be ahead..same goes for offleash walks..Merlin is always first..the other two never attempt to go ahead of him so ingrained is his Alpha status. Didn't mean to go on about my crew but it's been very interesting to watch the dynamics and ironically there is rarely fights as there once was in the beginning. Triggers have been removed and now there is only the occasional noises and Merlin breaks it up immediately. Things can change too as in the case of Blue suddenly playing for the first time in his life. He had a motive for doing so. You gave a hint when you said Chumley allowed Maggie to eat a bone in front of her..which suprised me. Allowing Maggie to eat it and not challenging her ..may possibly be her way of letting Maggie be alpha but too early to tell yet. I would continue to give Chumley the majority of your attention as, if she was the Alpha giving her due respect as the pre-existing dog in the household. If you needed to take them for walks seperately I would take Chumley first..then Maggie. In time you will see who emerges as the "top dog". You may be lucky as most of the people in this forum are when introducing a new member and have dogs that develope strong bonds with one another and the Alpha isn't that noticable. As I've said I've had many dogs in my household and my situation is rare (Blue vs Panda) ..I'm confident that in a few weeks there will be bonding between Chumley and Maggie. I am one that believes in the Alpha mentality, although there has been many differences of opinion..I see it to be true in my household. Marianne and the boys |
| Oh Bosley's Mom, you are so right, especially with females! (That's why I love my boys!!!!)
You just have to go with the flow (fluid dynamic, flow  ). Usually if you go with the older dog first you should be good to go. One thing I would say is that as Chum gets older you need to make sure that Maggie is more careful around her. Those younger dogs are so exhuberant that in their excitement over treats they can knock down or bump over the older, less physically stable dog. Make sure they sit for their treats and try to have them a little ways apart in case Maggie does get excited and jumps up she won't knock Chum down. Routine helps to curb this also. If they know there is an order to things they settle into that and there's less of a mad rush for treats or pets or whatever. |
| This is fascinating and very helpful. Maggie is definitely assertive -- wants to go through doors and upstairs first (I insist on going first but she gets there before Chumley) but she's also a scaredy-cat. At the park, when she is nervous, she backs up and sits so that her butt is touching Chum. Chum is generally sitting still enjoying being petted and doesn't mind Maggie pressed up against her. Very infrequently, Chum growls to put her in her place but mostly she ignores her. Chum is really people oriented. I really appreciate the insight from all of you with multi-dog environments. It is so interesting how complex the dynamics can be. |
| First of all Val, congrats on your new addition!!
Complex dynamics for sure. I would just respect their hierarchy and try not to force any alpha roles. Your girls will sort out their living arrangements on their own. As long as there's no blood shed then they are doing just fine. We adopted #2 OES (5 y.o. female) that joined our now 22 month old male. She always lived with a lot of dogs and with only 1 person. She's rather timid for an OES although she has never had any trouble putting Frank in his place when he started acting like a monkey around her. She still is getting used to her to all of her new neighborhood surroundings. Every day seems to be an improvement for her towards being an out of the shell goofball. |
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