Sheep dog coat
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| I've found that the hair usually grows back at about 1" per month. Is this the first time Gus has been shaved down? Sometimes if the mats are too dense, there is no other option. Been there, done that, as have most of our members.
He'll get used to it. Drez LOVES it when she's first cut down.  She minds the heat so much and pants like crazy if her hair is allowed to get too long. In the winter she minds the heat in the house, in the summer she minds the heat outside. Can't win! 
One cool thing about having a shaved sheepdog is that it's like having two completely separate dogs - they don't look anything like themselves!! 
Chris |
| This is the first time he has been shaved. I don't think the mats were too dense, I am very careful about brushing him several times a week. I am just disappointed because I love his coat. He does get hot easily, but loves to be outside in the snow and cold weather and now with no fur I worry about him getting cold. I hope that his fur will grown back at an inch a month. Our cats both hissed at him last night when he got home because they did not recognize him. I had to bring them up to him so they could smell him and understand it was Gus and not a new dog because he looks so different. I feel like I have a new dog. |
I would've been very upset to pick up my dog and find that he'd been shaved that close if they hadn't called me to ask me about it first. 
Thankfully it does grow back pretty quickly. I had Beaureguard shaved in July and he's got about 4" of hair now. They do look completely different, so I'm not surprised your cats didn't know who he was! LOL I hope Gus will learn to enjoy his new look and I'm sure with a sweater, he'll be fine. |
| Thanks. Our two guys are our kids and I just feel horrible that he was shaved. I had no idea how long it was going to take for him to get a coat back. I feel better knowing that it will be a few months I was thinking it would be longer. I am sure that I am much more upset about the whole thing than Gus is. It is funny because our second sheep dog came home looking absolutely beautiful, she did a great job on him. |
| If you like your groomer, you might want to have a serious talk to her about notifying you of, how best to put it, drastic measures? Even if they were having a hard time with the mats, they should've let you know what was going on before you got a bald surprise! If you're not showing, and the coat is long enough, scooping a couple of mats shouldn't be a problem. Clyde has a couple of spots that had to be cut and you'd never know it by looking at him! |
| I too would have been VERY upset if one of my girls was in full-coat and ended up shaved. BUT... since he can't get his long hair back overnight and it will eventually grow back, try to find some positives about his current situation. This may sound stupid but I think dogs do pick up on our feelings and you don't want him to be mortified so don't let him think something is wrong with him.
My girls love the freedom of a puppy cut (3/4 to 1") and run around like complete nuts after. Your sheepie-boy will be cooler and won't have to be groomed much for a while. After I clipped Panda shorter she stopped the horrendous drooling that probably was the cause of her stained beard. (It's coming in white now!) Just find a nice warm coat so he doesn't get cold... cover him with a blanket if the house is cool or keep the coat on him in the house if necessary. Just be sure the coat will not be a choking hazard should it get hooked on something. I'd sit the groomer down and ask why she took such drastic steps in his grooming. If this happened to me, I'd always take a picture along in the future to show exactly what is expected. Make several copies so you can hand one to his future groomer each time he's in for a touch-up.  |
| No, I don't show, they are both spoiled rotten pets, but I did love to have him in a nice coat. I am trying not to be upset in front of him because I know he would pick up on it. He was sulking in the car after I picked him up last night. We have him clipped shorter in the summertime because of the heat, but never this short. On the positive side, he will be able to grow in his beard all nice and white again. I am going to take him shopping this weekend for a comfortable and warm coat. I am most worried about the cold because winter is almost here, and he loves to run around and play in the snow. |
| Awwww... just give him a big hug and tell him he's the most handsome sheepie-dude there is. Make a big deal about how cute he is with his new 'do.
I'd monitor his outdoor activities to be sure he doesn't get cold... check for shivering and don't let him have real long play periods outside as it gets colder. You might want to get or make a couple of coats so one can dry out and the next is ready to wear. We're in Michigan so I can understand your concern about the weather turning cold. Yikes... we had some light snow today. |
| Thanks for your help. This site is a wonderful resource for inforamtion about sheepdogs. I can sympathize with the snow, although we have not had any yet, we have had some sleet and freezing rain and they are saying snow flurries later this week. |
This message board is a neat place... we all have that common bond. As I'm writing, the snow is falling harder. Looks like I'm going to loose my bet with my husband.  He had 'til midnight for us to get some accumulation in order to win.
Alas, I have a pile of Columbia-type material and only one of the sheepie coats made. I'm a horrible seamstress but I found it was cheaper to get good quality material and make them myself. Even if they won't look like it came off the shelf. I can, however, monogram them with their names!
Yikes! Sleet and freezing rain? I guess it's just part of where we live. |
| Ohh, I can fully understand your shock at seeing Gus shaved. I took Max in over the summer knowing he would be shaved, but nothing could've prepared me for the sight I'd witness when we returned!! He looked like nothing I'd ever seen, so different. My kids and I started laughing and could not stop!! Poor Max, after we got over our shock, we told him how handsome he was and gave him lots of hugs. He really liked his new cut. His fur is now about 3 inches maybe, and I plan on having him shaved again in the spring!!
Sharon |
| I took Nelson to PetSmart for grooming when he was about six months old, mostly for socialization and partly to see if I could let him out of my sight with a stranger. They insisted he had mats (he didn't, I had just groomed him myself) and demanded that I sign a release allowing them to cut the mats out. I wouldn't sign their release without adding that they were not allowed to shave him and had to notify me before cutting anything out. The girl at the desk was a real witch but the lady who did the actual grooming was very good and everything turned out okay.
It may not be perfect but I do my own grooming now. Nobody around here really knows what to do with an Old English Sheepdog on the grooming table. If I have to shave my dogs myself at least there's only me to blame for the outcome  As the hair comes off you have some time to get adjusted to "the look". |
| I would of been upset at what they did!! They should of at least notified you first before clipping so short. Trouble is a lot of groomers aren't groomers, they cant be bothered spending time combing gentley out a matt, so the quick easy solution for them is GET THE CLIPPERS OUT & shave the whole lot off. |
| I was a groomer for 20 years and that was one of the first things taught to me, ALWAYS ask, ALWAYS tell, before you do ANYTHING drastic like shave a dog in full coat down.
I would have expected you to be furious, regardless if the reason was your dog was matted. And your right lisaoes, many people that claim to be groomers, are far from it. Grooming, in my opinion is an art form, it's not just a 9 to 5 job you go to for a pay check. I ALWAYS had fun at my job and let my creative side come out at work. I loved nothing more then getting a matted dog in and turning into a thing of beauty. If I had to work on it longer then expected, then I called all my clients and told them I was running behind and would give them a call when thier pup was ready. Or I would work on the matted dog a while and then let it rest while I worked on another dog. I feel there is no need to rush and just shave a dog down because you don't want to make time, or Gosh forbid ACTUALLY have to WORK at getting the dog dematted. Most groomers are in it for the money! Not all mind you, but it seems more and more people are grooming because they THINK it's a pie job. Sorry, it's far from it, it's hot, dirty, smelly, hard work! It's a great money job though, if you can put up with all the above I mentioned. At the end of my grooming career I was getting $35.00 for a Toy Poodle and I could get a Poodle done in about an hour and a half (Non-matted) start to finish. Many times in less then that. But anyway, what I'm getting at is, many groomers want to rush the dogs through so they can make more money and the quikest way to achieve that is the shave down. And many will do it regardless of what the owner wants them to do. I worked for a shop once that would shave ANY dog down and claim it was matted, when infact is was not. All for more money. The owner of the shop said he didn't mind some tongue lashes here and there as long as he got paid. And the owners ALWAYS paid before even seeing their dog. It REALLY sucked working there. From now on when you go into any grooming shop, tell them under no circumstances is your dog to be shaved unless you are called before hand. Better yet follow that up with a written note stating the very same thing and request that the note be clipped onto the dogs work sheet so it WILL be seen by all people working on the dog. And make sure and do this every single time you take your dog in. |
| Gus's Mom,
Incidents such as this are why I won't use a professional groomer on our boys. And as Shuffles has pointed out few so-called professional groomers are anything more than barely competent technicians who are capable of grooming only the most simply (minimally?) coated breeds. Few are adequately capable and quite simply there are very very few people to whom I would trust my boys' coats. (Michele and I have even had problems with other OES show exhibitors messing up their coats as they "taught" us how to show trim!) OES are, arguably, THE SINGLE MOST DIFFICULT and TIME CONSUMING breed to groom properly and maintain in a good full-coat presentable condition. Groomers at chain store outlets such as PetSmart etc., and even supposedly quality grooming salons are most frequently "generalist groomers" who usually tend to less challenging breeds. Even if a particular groomer would like to "try to do" an OES to expand their own "portfolio and experience level", the business structure of these stores and salons set finite timelines to complete a dog. (witness their fundamental business tool - an appointment book!) Flat fees of $35.00 - $50.00 simply cannot cover the costs incurred in properly grooming an OES. If an OES were to be properly and thoroughly groomed even a $100.00 flat fee would not support an adequate profit margin after shop overhead costs and the groomer's salary is paid! Few people would be able, or even willing to pay $30.00 - $50.00 per hour for the 3-4 hours it would take to dematt and groom an OES that is not groomed at home and only sees a groomer once or even twice a month. The simple and fast solution is to clip or outright shave the dog as you have experienced. They are a business and exist to make a profit. (There is nothing wrong with that, every business exists to make a profit or they go under. The problem is that with an OES few if any can make a profit at the fee level most people would be willing and able to pay for grooming.) Few people demand any corrective action/compensation let alone sue for unauthorized clipping and shaving or even just poor grooming standards so these stores and salons generally "get away" with their sub-standard performance and continued medicrity! Yes there are some who do a decent job but they are few and far between. Many threads here attest to that! For instance consider that when I groom Martin Zephram and Virgil Tiberius it takes me an absolute MINIMUM of 2 1/2 hours to line groom both sides, brush out the inside of the legs and belly, brush the head and complete the beards and ears. If I haven't brushed them for 4-5 days and their coats are therefore "tight", if they have had upset stomachs and thus have butt "klingons", if their ears need extra care, if they are even slightly knotted from their boisterous rough play or they have particularly dirty beards then grooming time requirments can quite easily jump to 4 or 5 hours each. Add in the extra requirement of showing the dog so that the undercoat must be maintianed and not be stripped out then it is easy to see how demanding this breed is and how ill-prepared most groomers are when faced with the requirements of a fully coated, or even moderately coated OES. I know it is not possible for every Bobtail parent to groom their furchild all the time, but if at all possible I highly recommend grooming be done at home as often as possible and grooming shop/salon visits be minimized. It is a wonderful time for bonding, you get to fully examine your dog and will notice any change in skin conditions, ear eye or nose problems and you will readily catch the appearance of wounds or even lumps that can indicate more serious health problems. And once the intial outlay for grooming tools is made you will quickly recover their costs from eliminating, or at least drastically reducing grooming session fees. Thanks and Cheers Carl |
| I was surprised, I have used this person before, and was very happy when I picked both of my boys up. I am really not sure what happened this time, I had brushed Gus out the night before and he had a couple of small mats, but nothing that I thought would have required shaving him down. I do know that I will be doing more of the grooming at home from now on. Your suggestions are a great help. I have never owned a sheep dog before, and am doing my absolute best to keep both them and their coats as healthy and happy as possible, but it a learning process that is on-going, even two years later. |
| Carl your post was so acurate, learn to groom your dogs and it is a wonderful bonding experience, you get to know every inch of your dog and can pick up anything out of the ordinary on them by grooming them yourself.
I found a lump on one of my girls many years ago and early detection saved her life. Show coats takes me about 4-5 hours to groom & trim, then usually wash the next day. My older dog still has a long coat, but as she is not in the showring I have stripped out the undercoat, she still has the look of long hair but without all the work, takes about 1 to 2 hours to brush her through once a week. I never let my dogs go past a week without grooming them. |
| I do all Blitzens grooming my self, she is inn full show coat, but I only use 2-3 hours every other week. I am very particular not to get her wet, because I think she gets more mattes then. I only let the groomer give here a bath and dry the coat before a show, and then I always tell here what brush to use. I always groom here before she go to the groomer, because they always take out too much undercoat. I would have don the bathing and drying too, but I think I use too long time, and my back does not like to bend over the bathtub for 1 hour |
| I just dropped Barney off this morning to get groomed (parents are coming tomorrow, so I want him to smell good ) and they asked me what I wanted done with the grooming and I said to just bathe him and groom him, not to cut him. I said the only thing I wanted was if there was no other way around a mat, and the lady then said that it was their policy to cut them if they are matted (I'm sure little mats are fine...)
But this was interesting to me because if I hadn't asked about it, and I had dropped him off and then if he had mats, he would be shaved when I picked him up, so it is maybe something people should ask about (the shaving policy) when dropping off the pups to get groomed. That way, you know what you are getting into, and can face the possibility of a shorn sheepie when you return... |
| Yesterday I took my 10 yr old to Petsmart for grooming yesterday. I adopted him a year ago and he was extremely matted, so bad you couldn't even begin to brush him. The groomer said she would need to shave him and I agreed to it. He looked so pitiful shaved. Yesterday at Petsmart I was told he was too matted and they would need to shave him. He does have some mats but nothing like he had when I took him in. I was so embarrased, it was very busy, many people around and I felt like they made me feel like such a terrible dog owner. I love my dog and he gets brushed/combed very often. I had them clip his nails and that was it. They wouldn't even bath him or try to demat him, it was shaving or nothing. I went to Petco and purchased spray on detangler/dematter, a clipper and the approprate grooming tools. I have researched oes grooming on the internet and will do it myself. After reading this forum I am feeling much better realizing others have experienced the same thing at chain petstores and am feeling better about my decision to not have him shaved down. I shed a lot of tears over this last night feeling like I was a terrible dog owner because of how they treated me. |
| Don't feel bad about this. 1. do you have a table 2. has he been groomed before 3. There are a few good video out there to show you how to groom. First thing is does the matts go right down to the skin. If not you on a bit of a winner. Most people just brush the dog but you need to learn how to line groom. Video's on this site. Use a poodle comb or a wide comb. This help to tease the matts apart. I also use a solft sliker to get rid ot some of the fluff (under coat ) Fingers are good pulling matts apart. I think the shorter the coat is the harder the matts are too take out. You can have a long hair dog & take out most of the under coat which does help not getting matts. You can shave his arm pits so it might be easy to look after as well. You wil get better advice than myself here as well |
| Happened to me too! Ramsey was about 7 months old. Not matted, she even felt him up and down, through the coat, said no no, he's fine, no mats at all, told me I did a great job on brushing him, etc. 8 HOURS LATER! I picked him up, to about an inch of fur! Needless to say, I NEVER went back, I was so upset, that they kept him that long to shave him! He had to pee so bad too, poor guy! My groomer now is amazing, she listens! Here are some pics of that experience, lol. Day before!    Day after!   I still laugh tho looking at him, haha. It grows back, and you get to start all over! |
Old thread, I know. But the perfect one for me to jump in. I had posted another thread about my sweet Sam. I've been sick and got behind on his grooming. There were mats on his head (under chin, sides of face) that I was having no luck getting out on my own. I took him to the groomer this morning (PetCo). I have used them the last three times and they did a good job, even scissor trimmed him well. When I dropped him off, I pointed out the mats and said I understood if they needed to be cut out. I told the length I wanted ideally (2 inches over his entire body, head included), but said I was okay if shaving was needed. I said, at least twice, when I took him in that I wanted his head the same length as his body (they had left it longer last time). I showed pictures (from some of the sweeties here on the forum  ) of what I wanted. A little while later, they called to say they had needed to shave out the mats. Because I knew they scissored him to get the 2 inch length, I told her to go ahead and use the clippers on the rest of him. 7 hours later, I picked up a standard poodle with markings just like my sweet sheepdog!!!!  His body is 2 inches in length, muzzle and throat shaved (just fuzz left), and he had a full 3-3 1/2 inch poof on the top of his head!  I knew it would take forever for them to do his whole body, but I did tell her she needed to fix the top of his head then. Again, I showed her a picture of a shaved sheepie and said I wanted the top of his head as short as the body. She took him over and got the clippers. And brought him back to us with a 2 1/2 inch top.  At that point I just wanted out of there. It's PetCo, so you pay before you see the results. I have taken pics, for my reference purposes, but refuse to post any. I will either be getting another groomer to even him out, borrow a friend's clippers, or buy my own and fix it. I would rather have a naked sheepie than a standard poodle. |
There is no excuse to botch up a client's pet when such clear directions are given. Definitely find a new groomer. It's not much consolation now but at least hair grows back quickly. Some day you may even look back on this haircut and laugh about it. But that may take longer than actually growing coat.  In the groomers defense, chain stores like Petco were starting points for many fine groomers. Make your choice by the individual rather than by their employer. It takes awhile to gain skills and money necessary to start a solo grooming business. As for the poodle look, most groomers learn on Standard Poodles. Competitions favor using this breed. OES are a rarer breed but there is no shortage of reference materials to follow. So sorry for this bad experience. Still, there is no way Sam could really look "bad". |
| I have a groomer who will charge by the hour to de-mat. I figure that's reasonable. In the last year or so she has complained of tendonitis, so I try and de-mat as much as possible before bringing them in, and I give her instructions to NEVER shave, and NEVER cut mats out. She'll groom around them if she has to, and leave them for me to continue removing afterward. I think its really important to have a groomer that you have a good relationship with. And ultimately? You get what you pay for. We searched for a groomer for a while, and in the end found one that specialized in show Poodles and Bishons. I knew since these breeds have very specific cuts for Confirmation showing, she's know how to research grooming a sheepdog. She's probably more expensive than some of our other options, but she's worth it. And when the summer comes around and the girls DO need a shave? It's always nicely shaped and not down way too short. I can't recommend it enough; do yourself a favor and seek out a well trained groomer; you'll be glad you took the time to do the research! |
| I took Lady to the groomers yesterday, she had been shaved down at thanksgiving and was finally fluffy again. I told the groomer I wanted a tiny trim no more than one inch cut off so she would be left with 2 inches of hair still. I told him don’t touch her tail or her face, if you have to clean it up a bit fine but don’t cut. He shaved her down to 5/8 of an inch. I was so upset I started to cry! Not only that but he shaved all the hair on her neck and chin and cut the fur on her cheeks in straight lines that didn’t go down to the base of her jaw so she looks like the joker and the ears are drastically longer than her face fur. I was so specific when I went in I even showed a picture to make sure nothing like this could happen. To make matters worse he shaved her privares so closely that she’s been crying and licking all night I had to put the cone of shame on her! All I wanted was to get her trimmed to stay at a puppy cut so we wouldn’t end up matted again and need to get shaved. Could use any emotional support- feeling like the worst mom ever right now! |
| Awwwe, I feel your pain. Well...more like my dog Jake once felt Lady's pain. First time I used my clippers on him I burned his penis shaft.... She will heal and the fur will grow back, and you can find a better groomer! |
| Just out of interest- did you pay for the shave? When that was done to my first oes when I was heavily pregnant with first child I was so cross I think the cake shop owner next door came in thinking I had gone into labour!! I had asked for a wash and blow dry, just trim feet, not shave so close you could see his skin all over. They did it because they thought I wouldn't care for him right after giving birth-I pointed out if I could keep his fur mat free at 9 months pregnant it should show how much I did care and look after him. I didn't pay and demanded a free bathe etc for the next 6 times I wanted them or be taking them to court-it worked. Never have I had a groomer to any of my dogs since. My daughter had the same problem when she took her oes for a small trim and ended up fully shaved. xx |
| Lazy groomer. Takes time to bust through a mat. Instead of shaving out the rub areas, like behind the hears and leg rubs, the groomer shaves off the whole dog because of time constraints. NEVER have mat on a dog when you take them in and go over the dog with the groomer before you go proving no mats. Doggies get over the "summer camp" cut. All of mine have a bit of shyness originally, but after a few years they know what's coming and tolerate it. Kensie was the best she's ever been for a shave down and then.........walked into the shower...........GASP....for the wash off. Somebody switched dogs on me. |
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