What age should I start herding classes?
I would like to finish up Leonard's level 2 obedience courses (we don't start until January as I am taking a Christmas break) and maybe let the weather get a little warmer before starting. The contact person for our local herding farm said the age to start them at really depends on the dog and breed. From the website it looks like mostly border collies that are involved. The contact person didn't have a suggestion for how old he should be and I got the impression she wasn't sure what kind of sheepdog he was. I know a lot of people on this forum have OES dogs who participate in herding so I figured you would have something to say on the subject! If you herd with your dog: What age did you start? What is involved in the classes? What should I look for in a class? (There are several places the offer the courses and I am curious to know which place to pick.) What kind of behaviours mean a dog will enjoy herding? (The courses are $250, which is fine if Leonard actually enjoys it; I hear this is an instinctual thing and that not all dogs are into it). What else should I know? ... Experiences positive or negative you have had. |
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This question has a lot of variables.  I would 1st talk with the places you are considering - and if possible go check out a class. And especially a class where they are doing intros to stock with new dogs. Many want you to have some basics - a stop, and a call off stock (a recall that will still happen even when your dog is intensely focused on the sheep). Some will work with you with no prerequisites. It also depends on your pup and how confident they are with the stock. The dog has to have more mental power over the sheep,than the sheep do over the dog. If the sheep are stubborn or even pushy, it can ruin a tender hearted puppy. A good herding place will have a variety of demeanored sheep, so they can be paired best with what the dog needs. Also, you need a place that is familiar with upright herding breeds, not just border collies and intense Aussies (who act just like BC's). These are not BC's, and they herd quite differently. If they only have BC mentality, they are not going to like the style of OES when herding, most likely. My 1st OES didn't start classes until he was 3 yrs - and he did great. 2nd one herding was Chewie, and he did his 1st instinct test at 13 months. He did a few exposures with classes to sheep before, but I don't remember quite what age he was. Bond was about 9 months old when he started working sheep. All 3 of them are very stock confident, but I was very careful to set them up in situations were they would succeed. We had a near failure when Chewie was a pup - he got in the sheep pen and one of our ewes was super aggressive mom (with her lambs) and she went on the offensive. She broadsided him full blast and pounded him into the wooden fencing panels. We smoothly got him out, built him up (no "oh poor puppy") and then avoided the sheep for a bit so he would forget. It worked  Good luck! Edit - One other thing - herding for the dog is actually more a mental game, not physical. If the dog is running around chasing the stock, they aren't doing it correctly. The stock should never break out of a walk or fast trot. If your dog is wildly chasing the sheep, it is NOT doing a good herding job. The object is to move the stock - not stress them, overheat them, etc. A real farmer has worked hard to get weight and condition on their sheep - they would never have a working dog who chased them and wore off the weight, or potentially causes injury. Now young dogs do go through this phase, and in part it's actually good - it helps get them "turned on" to the stock. But then real training should quickly follow. With Bond I spend every class session working on not pushing the sheep too hard and learning self control...it's a tough job! |
| Wow! Thanks for all of the information Dawn! He has been exposed to different types of animals since he was old enough to do so safely in my various socialization efforts; we went to a few farms where he has met all sorts of farm animals (through the fence) and the only ones he doesn't seem to like are pigs. He was very suspicious of the piggies. The sheep he watched with interest but hasn't been on the other side of the fence so don't know what would happen then. My husband's father is a cattle farmer so he has had a lots of exposure to cows of all sizes and horses since he was a tiny puppy. He doesn't seem to want to chase them, rather sit and watch them with intense interest, off leash he has never tried to get into the cow's pasture. We will be bounding by, stop and watch them for a few minutes, then bound off and start bugging their serious working dog (great Pyrenees, who is always "on duty" and has no time for bouncing puppies) later he will bound back to the cows and watch. He seems interested in the horses but again he just sits and stares as if in awe. The herding farm's website shows a Rottweiler and schnauzer herding champions that they work with and what looks like a bearded collie mix herding. They host annual CKC trials and say they have 50 sheep of various ages to work with. I will likely wait until he is at least a year old because while his impulse control is really coming along; we work on it every day and he is still pretty young. We have done lots of outdoor training where he has to sit stay while camping, at the beach or on a hike surrounded by squirrels, birds and other distractions and he is getting better at that. A pen full of sheep and lots of other dogs around would probably be a bit much for him at this point. I like the idea of mental exercise for him; I find a leashed walk with lots of training stops tires him out the same if not more than an hour of running off leash. He seems to be very smart and a little bold. If he doesn't get some sort of mental stimulation every day he is a completely different dog.  (while I have been writing this post he has come up to me about 3 times, licked my hand and then laid put his head on my foot and sighed as if to say, "I'm boooored, let's dooo something") I know extra classes are lots of work but when I decided to get another dog I figured he would need an outlet of some sort. In my experience if a dog (especially a young one) isn't given an outlet they may find their own; something that isn't always the best thing for our home or our sanity. Thanks SO MUCH for the information, have sent off some questions to the herding farm! You have given me lots to consider .....Now off to play with my pacing sheepie! |
| Eevee took her instinct test at 8 months. Before she went in, she just watched the sheep from outside the pen, didn't really try to go after them. Then when we went in the pen, she wasn't totally sure what she should do, until I got in the pen with her and chased the sheep around myself. Then it was like it clicked, "Oh, I'm allowed to chase the sheep, mom said so!" The instinct test doesn't require her to do anything other than show that she's interested in the sheep. I wouldn't be able to really do anything beyond that with her, there's no way I can get her to stop once she's started at this point other than getting a hold of her, so we need to work a lot on recalls while she's doing something fun since she never wants to listen then. So if we could start classes at all, I'd hold off until later just because I know she probably won't listen to me that well just yet. Sadly, there are no herding classes within 3 hours of me, so I guess it'll have to wait anyway! |
| I saw pictures on their website, it looks like they start off herding geese on a long lead... There are lots of pictures of dogs herding geese on a looong line, maybe that is to help with the excited dogs who don't want to listen? 3 hours? That sucks! That's a long way to go for sheep! |
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