Simon the bully
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| When Simon takes her toys from her, take them back from Simon and give them back to Bella and move Simon to another room for a short while. If he back and trys to take her toy again, say no Simon and take him to the other room again. It will take time, but eventually, all you'll have to say is "no, Simon" and he will stop. Regarding when Bella has time alone with you and you come back home, bring Bella in, but don't let Simon get to her, weither it is putting Simon in another room as Bella comes in and gets settled. Then Simon comes in and if he starts bullying her, tell him "no, Simon" and move him out of the room. It does take a lot of work. In the past, I've had similar problems with Violet (hence her nickname the violator) and China. It took a lot of consistant work, but now they are fine around each other. Dogs are smarter then you think. I don't tolerate the bullying. Don't tell my children this, but raising dogs reminds me alot of raising children. There were things I wouldn't tolerate from my children, so didn't allow with the dogs either. My dogs know what I say I mean, so just a way of training them. My dogs are not perfect and every once in a while we may have an issue, but I step in right away. Good luck, I hope Simon relaxes and Bella gets her "happy sheepie" back. |
| Wish I could help. Heartbreaking isn't it? My rescue dog pulls this nonsense all the time and not just with one dog but all except Sybil. Every so often they get fed up and gang up on her and beat her up a bit, butit doesn't change a darn thing. I'm seriously considering going back to crating her at night again. Other times when she gets over the top I quietly put her in another room hoping she'll figure out it ain't working, to the contrary. I do crate her during the day so the rest of them get some peace that way. She's an incredibly needy, insecure dog, which is probably at the root of her problem, but it is HER problem and my other dogs shouldn't be forced to suffer for it. On the flip side some times she's a wee bit less neurotic if she's been really busy (running/fetching/agility practice etc) Maybe Simon needs a job? Boot camp? Military school?  Kristine |
| I think Simon needs a job. I tried him in agility but he was horrible. All he wanted to do was herd the other dogs there, but never got any of the obsticals. Bella loves agility. I thought about herding but my vet said it would only reinforce his bad behavior herding other dogs. I am clueless how to help him. He has no doggie social skills. I am using clicker training with him now, taking him to dog parks and just getting close enough that he can see the other dogs and clicking and treating him when he is calm. Hoping he will finally get it that if he is calm he can play but he is a challenge. |
Bellalover wrote: I thought about herding but my vet said it would only reinforce his bad behavior herding other dogs. Does your vet have any experience with herding? I would question this advice. Maybe give a herding school a call and ask if they have had issues with dogs who herd other dogs getting worse once they starting working sheep. |
| I have to agree with what Helen says. Don't let him get away with it. Remove him from the situation and give Bella what she needs...protection from the bully. If this was someone's else's dog bullying her, what would you do? |
| Thanks, Helen, I love your advise and will put it into practice immediately. Kristine, I have hesitated to crate Simon because he's my rescue boy and spent the first 3 years of his life in a crate until I adopted him. He goes into the crate by himself sometimes but I don't want to confine him there. But I can use another room to remove him from Bella when he's being a Butthead. He is another incredibly needy dog and I think that is the root of the problem. And Kim, I will call the local herding school. My vet is very involved with agility but not herding so maybe she isn't necessarily informed. I love my Mr Simon, I just want to make things better here so Bella doesn't suffer from his issues. She is such a sweet, gentle, loving sheepie and playful and happy. We want to do therapy but so far she has not been able to pass the separation part of the CGC test...we've failed it three times. I keep thinking if we solved the bully issue here she would be better at passing. |
Wish I had some advice.. unfortunately I don't - but did want to share we have similar issues. Simon sounds very much like my Saxon (who is the most affectionate 'needy' boy who I love dearly  ) but I will confess he is a bully. He takes Inca's toys, treats, anything that she has. He 'herds' her when they're off lead, to the point she won't move because she's fed up with him. He will also challenge her if she gets out of the car before him, and sometimes when going through doorways (well, he used to, we seem to have got over that now thankfully). BUT Inca is one tough cookie, and she doesn't put up with his nonsense. She lets him take her things, herd her, and generally be a pain most of the time, but if he takes it too far she is right there to tell him off the only way a sheepie can (big and loud  ) So, we are lucky in that sense.. Inca is still Inca, and is most definitely top dog - which helps a lot.Bellalover wrote: He has no doggie social skills. I am using clicker training with him now, taking him to dog parks and just getting close enough that he can see the other dogs and clicking and treating him when he is calm. Hoping he will finally get it that if he is calm he can play but he is a challenge. We are doing this currently too - how are you finding it? We even do it at home with Inca in one space and Saxon in another, separated by a gate so he can still see her but not get to her (he gets crazy when she is training or playing alone  ). I'm finding it incredibly slow going but willing to persevere and hope that it will 'click' at some point! |
| My lenny is really bullying my other dog Mac. Mac has always been a softy so he just gives up and lets lenny win. BUT we have started saying to Mac "get him" and he pushes Lenny out the way when he bullies him. If they then fight then Mac will win as he is older and more wiser than Lenny. I know exactly how you feel about her being sad and cautious. |
Bellalover wrote: And Kim, I will call the local herding school. My vet is very involved with agility but not herding so maybe she isn't necessarily informed. I had my bully beast herding instinct tested and she failed miserably due to chasing...some testers will pass chasing because at least the dog is showing "sustained interest", but she was blatantly predatory and just in it for herself/lunch. Now, herding does have its roots in a dog's prey drive, but it's supposed to be a team effort, with handler being the one calling the shots, dog not running around yelling "where's the mint jelly to go with my lamb???!!!".   I don't think it made her any worse (of course, it was just the one time exposure in any event) but I doubt it was going to make her any better.I'm with your agility instructor on this one, though we could both be wrong. But the only time the Beast is truly happy is when we're working in agility. She turns herself inside out to run. Of course, she frequently turns me inside out too, or at least black & blue, but it does make her one happy, tired camper and afterwards she's usually less traumatic to live with for a while. But whatever works for a given dog. Kristine |
| Inca's Human, the clicker is training is really slow going but I am seeing some good results. We are able to get closer to the other dogs without his reacting, even when the other dogs are running which is a real trigger for him. But he is no way, shape or form ready to be turned loose in a dog park! Due to some pretty serious health issues we had to take a break from our every other day trip to the park for training and we're just starting again. Clicker training seems to be the best method for Simon. Kristine, with Simon I kinda agree with you and my vet about the herding. He is totally predatory. Remember he killed all those kittens? And he chases other dogs just to chase and herd them. When he gets in that zone he does not hear me. I had the same problem with him at agility. When it was our turn to practice an obstacle, if he saw another dog running he was off chasing that dog. I couldn't take him off leash at all. Kinda hard to do the A frame on a leash, lol. I've been putting him on 10 minute "timeouts" in the bathroom when he bullies Bella. He gets it for that day, then we start all over the next...sigh....love my crazy, needy rescue boy. I've been biking him now.....(thank god for cortisone shots, I haven't been able to bike for over two years!) I have a K9 cruiser attachment for my bike that attaches to the rear axel so if he decides to go nuts he can't pull me over. This is tiring him out and making life a bit easier!  I wish I knew anyone here who did carting, I think he'd be really good at that. He's a strapping, muscular 90 lbr...... |
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