Finally found the culprit - its Sarcoptic Mites
 I did some reading on here about mange and found out some of you highly recommended "Ivermectin". Perhaps I should look into this as well. I will bring this up to the vet when I pick my babies up from the vet office later today. They are at the vet office enjoying a lime sulfur dip now  I hope this will really help Kahlua feeling better while we carry on finding the cure for her  |
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| Woohoo!! Doing the happy dance for you and Kahlua! Yay for mites!  |
While not fun for your itchy pups, it sounds like good news to get a real diagnosis for the problem. Thank goodness, now you all can concentrate on getting better!  |
| Thanks Jaci and Dawn. I also never imagine I would say this too---Yay for mites Poor Kahlua came back from the vet and looked miserable. She is resting now. I could not imagine what she has gone through the past two weeks. I put her on these steroid meds and gave her cortisone injection. I basically created a festival of mites infestation on her  I feel so bad to find out I have been making her feel worse all these time  She was running a fever this morning when I took her to the vet. Poor baby.Vet said she will go back for another dip in 7 days and he will by then put her on some medication as well. Vet only have time to dip two pups today, so tomorrow I am bringing in the other two. (After doing some reading on this forum) I followed Dawn's advice and ordered the Mutant gene MDRI test kits for my four furry kids. I would like to put the pups on Ivermectin. I am also going to buy new dog beds that have removable cover so I can wash it every day. Not sure what to do with the couch though...the cover is not removable and so I can't wash it in the washer  |
| That's a good idea. I run MDR1 gene tests on every new dog we bring in. My pack is normal/normal. We did skin scrapings on Bumble while trying to get a diagnosis. They don't always find them so I asked for it to be repeated. We eventually did the treatment with Revolution in case there were mites... 1 treatment ever 2 weeks for 4 treatments. We had a biopsy done also and it came back as no parasites and pyoderma so we discontinued the Revolution after the 2nd treatment. I'm not sure if Revolution is the way your vet would want to go but it's said to work for sarcoptic mange. https://www.revolution4dogs.com/default ... %20It%20Is Quote: Q: What is Revolution® (selamectin)? A: Revolution is the first-ever FDA-approved, topically applied medication for dogs that: * Prevents heartworm (Dirofilaria immitis) disease * Kills adult fleas (Ctenocephalides felis) and prevents their eggs from hatching * Treats and controls ear mites (Otodectes cynotis) * Treats and controls sarcoptic mange (Sarcoptes scabiei) * Controls American dog tick (Dermacentor variabilis) infestations Not sure what to recommend for the couch. Hmm. Wondering if you could quarantine it  for the natural life cycle of a sarcoptic mange mite then allow it back into the pack. LOLQuote: The mites prefer to live on the dog, but will live for several days off of the host in the environment. In cool moist environments, they can live for up to 22 days. At normal room temperature in a home, they will live from 2 to 6 days. Because of the mite's ability to survive off the host, dogs can become infected without ever coming into direct contact with an infected animal. Source: http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm ... 89&aid=764 |
| Yeah for mites.. at least you know what you are dealing with now. |
What great news! You never think bugs are good news, until you realize that the diagnosis can mean a start to treatment and relief! I'm so glad for you, and your pups!  |
| I agree it's better than allergies or something. Bugs, once you get rid of them, should be gone for good, and not something chronic or permanent like an allergy. |
| Glad you've got a diagnosis... people too often (vets included) jump to food allergies, when really they're not that common. Re the sarcoptic mange, those kind of mites are contagious to humans, aka scabies. Keep an eye on your hands! |
| One of the former members on here (bosley's mom - gosh i wonder how's she doing?) had an OES, Dixie with a serious skin issue - had to wear a tshirt too.. Not sure what was the culprit but you might want to PM her for advice/ideas? Not sure she'll respond but she was very informative on many medical issues. Glad to know that Kahula is on the road to recovery! yay |
| not sure if this would work for the couch but isn't there some sort of treatment that they do for bedbugs.....I think they wrap the item up in plastic and it gets some sort of heat treatment and maybe gas or something after that. It might be worth contacting a company that deals in exterminations. |
| Yippee for a diagnosis!!!!!! Laurie and Oscar |
| Kahlua thanks everyone for the well wishes. She seems to have gotten worse after the dip. She still scratches herself very intensively. Everytime she is asleep, I will not even dare to move, so as to not to wake her up because whevenver she is not sleeping, she scratches herself to all raw and blood. All the fur around her arm pits, shoulders and chest is already gone. All this just happened within the past few days. I have done some research online and found out there are a few alternative treatments for sarcoptic mites out there: -Ivermectic (my vet does not recommend it at all) -Prolate®/Lintox®-HD dip -Hydrogen Peroxide and Borax mix dip -Apple Vinegar Cider/Mayonnaise (to suffocate the mites by covering the sites with mayonnaise) I tried the mayonnaise method. Smear a thick layer on her and let it dry for about an hour then dilute the hydrogen peroxide with water and dissolve a couple tbs of borax in it, soak a piece of cloth with the solution and laid it on her infected area. She didn't seem to enjoy it and I think she scratched even more afterwards So last night, none of us were able to sleep, my husband and I sat there trying to sooth her back to sleep to no avail until 3am. She finally got too exhausted and fell asleep. This morning, I found that her armpit is all swollen. We took her back to the vet. Vet is keeping her there and to give her an injection and to treat her wound. He also suggested to keep her there over night so we can get some good sleep but I will not do that. Kahlua will be more comfortable being home than staying overnight in the kennel at the Vet's I have also contacted Bosley's mom. Dixie had demodex mange, a different type and non contagious mite. She is really suffering very badly and I am not able to come up with anything to help her. My husband and i are so very devastated. She is such a sweet, sweet baby girl.... |
| It makes sense to me that the medication to kill the mites would be irritating to her skin. Especially as I bet it stings in her already open and raw spots. Maybe they can give her something to lessen the sensation, or even sedate her so she can make it through the treatment without going crazy? Poor Kahlua, she has a tough time here  But it will be worth it when those pesties are dead!! |
| How come your vet dosen't recommend the Ivermectic? I heard that it work well for mange/mites. |
| Dawn, I have thought about sedating her as well. I will call the vet and see what he says... Brenda, the conversation was relayed to me by my husband. So I will need to ask the vet for a more detailed explanation. I told my husband to ask the vet if we could go ahead and give her Ivermectic and the vet's reply was just " this medicine won't work for her case" Vet also suggested on top of the socks, I should also put her hind legs on some kind of bondage, so that she could still walk but not able to lift her leg up far enough to scratch her armpit... How on earth can that be done? |
Gigi wrote: Vet also suggested on top of the socks, I should also put her hind legs on some kind of bondage, so that she could still walk but not able to lift her leg up far enough to scratch her armpit... How on earth can that be done? Sounds like she needs a body suit. Hoping you find the solution to her pain soon  |
| Did you ask about topical Revolution? You put it between the shoulder blades. Natural products are best but there are times when infestations require more. The skin is already irritated, the dip likely caused more irritation, and anything new applied to the skin may be even more irritating. Wondering if her skin should be allowed to calm down for a week or so while protecting it with clothing. I know when Bumble's skin was more irritated from scratching, we put a soothing dog product Epi-Calm or Soothe (I don't know what it was called) from the vet on his skin and it became physically hot and even more irritated. Wondering if it would do any good to use just a baking soda rinse rather than more washing if she needs to be wet down again. As always, ask the vet before doing anything new with her though! http://nzymes.com/pc/viewContent.asp?id ... gsodarinse Quote: Using a final rinse of BAKING SODA AND WATER for the pets body after shampooing can be very effective to reduce the overall itchiness and smell. Mix two (2-4) teaspoons of BAKING SODA per gallon of water; make sure to mix it so it completely dissolves. USING BAKING SODA IN A SPRAY BOTTLE Mix one (1-2) heaping teaspoons of BAKING SODA with 8 oz. of water. Use this with a spray bottle or cotton ball for the itchy rashes areas. Reports show that it is quite helpful with the overall itchiness, skin problems and inflammation. Soaking a cloth with this baking soda solution and leaving it on the more severely affected areas can be helpful to soothe the skin and reduce inflammation. Quote: Vet also suggested on top of the socks, I should also put her hind legs on some kind of bondage, so that she could still walk but not able to lift her leg up far enough to scratch her armpit... How on earth can that be done? Does he mean a hobble? I would think you'd need to be careful that she didn't hurt herself if using one... at least until she got used to it. http://www.dogleggs.com/process/images/ ... age002.jpg http://www.dogleggs.com/ |
| Jaci: I asked about Revolution when I picked her up from the office the day before. The doctor replied me saying that he will prescribe something for her in a week, but at that point he had not decided which one yet... Honestly, I didn't understand why we have to wait for a week. I didn't know she would be suffering like that, so I didn't ask further when he said to wait for a week. I was assuming it is normal to wait for a week before giving her any further chemical after the dip. When I pick her up from the vet's office today, I will ask again if it is neccessary to wait for a week!! I read it online that the mites get more active in a warm environment, so I took her clothes off and put two layers of socks on instead. The socks stayed on the whole night but she still scratched herself all swollen and bloody. And just like Bumble, when she is having an itchy espisode, that part of her body is very, very warm. I am not supposed to wash her after the dip, so all I can do is to soak a cloth with cold lavender water and lay it on her burning skin to try to sooth her down. I don't think it helped her at all. She looked at us with her big puppy eyes, wagged her tail and begged us to help her feel better...but I wasn't able to do anything to help her |
| would benadryl help her? I done a little research this afternoon and Ivermectin (sp) is used for both type of mites.. although there are some herding dogs, Collies, Sheppards and Australians that it is not recommended cause of some gene thing.. (Jaci?) |
| Thanks Brenda I have order a test kit for Kahlua to find out if she has the mutation that causes the sensitivitiy reaction to Ivermectin. Got a confirmation saying the test kit was shipped out yesterday. I don't know when I can get a result back even if I return a test sample to them via overnight shipping, the same day I received the kit. My Vet is very old school...he simply thinks it is too dangerous to try that on Kahlua because of her breed. I told him about the test I am giving her but he said those tests are just testing their gene to see if they belong to one of the breeds that are likely to have the mutation gene. I don't think he has heard of this Multi Drug Test offered by VetMed http://www.vetmed.wsu.edu/depts-VCPL/index.aspx I faxed him the information but have not heard back from him regarding this. She doesn't even respond to the steroid med for her itchiness...but I will ask the Vet if I can give her Benadryl. Thanks Brenda |
| Feel sorry for both of you. She's miserable and so are you trying to find something to make her feel better. Maybe if you don't get any satisfactory answers it might be time to see what another vet has to say. |
| I know you and your husband are suffering right along with her. None of us really know what will help her be more comfortable... it may just take some time . One thing that seem to protect Bumble's skin most is cotton denim material. It strong and holds up to the scratching. |
| aww sometimes old school is not always the way to go! Did you try looking up a dermatologist specialist for a second opinion? They might know what to do- especially since mange is common here. scary There are clinics in your area http://www.animaldermatology.com/locations |
| Just a picture of Bumble's denim jacket- http://oesusa.com/index.1442.jpg A seamstress I'm not  but it helps to protect the skin when he scratches.It's a heavier cotton denim. If the problem continues, you might be able to make something she steps into that has maybe 1/2 sleeves with Velcro on the back. |
Oh my Dog!! I could have kissed you  I tried googling a dermatologist in the area the other day and couldn't come up with any!! Thank you Thank you!!! I have already made an appointment. They only come to my area once a month and the next one available is 12/21. At first they told me they are already fully booked but I told them my case and pratically begged them ...And now I got a 9:00am appointment on the 21st!!Thank you soooo much!! |
| Jaci: I think I should attempt sewing something for Kahlua with cotton denim. I am not a seamtress either but I think she won't mind wearing something poorly fitted and horrible workmanship....  I found this body suit specically made for allergy problem. http://www.faithfulpetproducts.com/cata ... 483906.htm I sent the message to see if this website is still active and if they will do expedite shipping. Maybe it is good for Bumble too? |
It makes my heart happy that you and your husband are Kahlua's parents  Murphy has allergies, mostly seasonal, but some food as well. When he itchies I give him Benadryl, it calms him and makes him realllllllllllllllllllllllyyyyyyyyyyyyyy sleepy. |
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