Puppy Kinder longish post
She was telling me yesterday about a new client in beginners who went to a puppy kinder where the puppies all ran around off leash wrestling and playing, or freaking out as this client's pup did. It was too boisterous an environment for this puppy. It reminded me of another topic, I forget which, where Kerry (I think) mentioned another forum she's on that didnt agree with puppy kinder. Kerry correct me if it wasnt you or I got that all wrong! And that got me thinking. My experience of puppy kinder is all puppies on leash, all the time. Very little if any free play and still on leash and very supervised by the instructor. It is used mainly to teach owners how to read their puppy a little. Stuff like if s/he is being dominant, what play bow is etc. Leasons for the owners on basic training, how to treat train to teach sit, down, stand, come, wait, heel, roll over, shake a paw. Diagrams and explanations for owners on the basics of dog communication ie tail position, hackles, ears, face. Problem solving behaviours like jumping up on people, toilet training or anything else the owner is concerned about. There are door mats, bits of carpet, grills etc for the puppies to walk on to get them used to different surfaces, a vacuum cleaner, broom, mop, CD of thunder and fireworks, party poppers, and a kiddies pram. All used with the instructor helping the owners use treats to help puppies get used to different experiences. Rules are No puppies off leash No puppies allowed to jump on people, all participants are expected to help train dogs not to jump by refusing to acknowledge any puppy that jumps on them No puppies allowed to rush up to or jump on other puppies, firm correction if this is attempted Remove your puppy from the situaiton and distract her/him if s/he is harrassing or intimidating another puppy What is your experience of puppy kinder, is it a structured learning environment or more of a free play experience? I had assumed that my experience of puppy kinder was what they are all like, now I realise that's not the case and am wondering what most puppy kinders are like. |
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Dutch and I went to puppy classes were the pups were all allowed to run free for about 10 min. twice in the hour. Many noises including an ind. vacumn was run to get them used to noises .If a pup was to aggressive in play it was taken back to it's owner to sit some of the free play the time out. As for Dutch I was to busy running after her to get her off the peoples laps she was trying to get on. She didn't want to play just get petted  |
| My puppy kindergarten was more formal. Dogs were not allowed to play until AFTER the session and then only a few minutes with those who wanted to play. We learned Look, leave it, place and just did some leash walking, etc. It was more for the humans I think and the pups learning to relax and be calm around other dogs. The trainer did let the pups play but only as a "reward" for being good after class.
I think for some pups, playing with the others in an unfamiliar place might be too stressful and if you see your pup looking scared, I don't think I would force it. It all comes in time and I think a BIG part of training puppies is for them to learn to trust you as the human to keep them safe and secure. |
and that other dogs are not toys for which they have an inallienable right  |
| I think I'd call an hour of free for all just a puppy play date, not a class. It's not like they're learning anything if they're not on lead and focused, you know?
I had one class where we had a regular, on leash class and then the puppies could play afterward for about 10 minutes. It was up to the owner if they wanted to let their dog stay and play. It was a class of only about 8 dogs and they were all pretty close in size and age. It was a good experience for Clyde. He did well in the environment and the other dogs were all cool, too. Owen's class was also all on leash but it didn't have the off leash time at the end. Instead, every other session, they brought out puppy agility equipment and we got to do that instead, which Owen loved. This was a much bigger class and there were dogs from 2 pounds to about 50 pounds so I don't think a free for all would have worked there anyway. I don't mind free play time if the situation is okay for it but I'd be annoyed if I paid for a class and that was all I got. |
| I was interested to read this post. Im currently going through puppy preschool and I feel that it hasn't really met my expectations.
The normal program is: 1. Puppy free play (off leash) for about 10-15 mins. This is a free for all where unfortunately Tilly is the biggest and most exuberant of all the dogs and starts to harrass some of the smaller dogs, and even some of the bigger dogs. 2. We learn something like sit, drop, leave it (which tilly hasn't yet mastered!), heel (again - not mastered) and leash walking. 3. We have a talk about health issues for dogs. I have come to the conclusion that it is sort of like an introduction to owning a dog, and also a puppy socialisation tool. Im hoping to go on to a much better puppy class once this one is over where Tilly can learn a bit more obedience and things that you discussed in your post Mim. If anyone can recommend such a class for the Canberra area i'd be grateful! |
This one is in canberra  Happy training 
http://www.bdoc.asn.au/BDOC_Newsletter_Jan_09.pdf I am not a big fan of puppy kinder for the reason of puppies of all sizes are allowed to go crazy off leash. Until they do learn manners then it can have a negative affect for ones so young. Big pups in with little ones, running around like crazy can intimidate others in the class. Or if your youngster gets picked on does nothing for their socialisation skills can have quite the opposite affect. After all the jabs are completed nothing better then starting them at a good obeience class where the instructors are trained in all things K9. and dogs start in a controlled situation and build on that. |
| Hudson's puppy classes were:
Free play at the start...five minutes. We worked on some skills (things like looking at you when you called their names, etc). We took turns trying new things (skills, play style, etc). Some treat almost up the nose practice of earlier skill while off leash. (i.e. they'd go play in the middle, and the owner would go up, call the dog's name, reward with a treat if they looked up, or waggle a treat under their nose and repeat their name if they didn't.) Most times that would take up the whole time, and as we all returned to our spots and packed up there was a minute or two for questions. Hudson really loved it, and did well with the other dogs. There were a few who were timid, and their owners would comfort/stroke/unintentionally reward the behaviour. It was a nice setting for some subtle intervention from the instructor. After a few sessions all the dogs played willingly and seemed more confident. One guy quit in a huff after the first session. He apparently thought that "puppy socialization class" meant guard dog training. He complained that he didn't want his dog to enjoy other dogs. He wanted his dog to avoid them. Of course Hudson was the social butterfly of the class who never once looked up at me while I called him. Hence, he is about to begin round six of obedience. Rudy's going to his first class on Monday, too. I predict by the end of this round, Rudy will be in the lead behaviourally. |
| There was no free play with Edgar's puppy class. But then there was 5 or 6 other dog classes going on in the field at the same time so that would have caused havoc.
Never being dog owners before Lee and I found puppy class interesting. Things were covered that dog books I read didn't. No loud noises were done, but all the basics along going thought the tunnel and walking up stairs were. Edgar did horrid because he doesn't have any concentration with "exciting" other people around or "wonderful" other dogs to try and play with. It was a good experience for us and I think him though. |
traciels28 wrote: Hudson's puppy classes were: 8O One guy quit in a huff after the first session. He apparently thought that "puppy socialization class" meant guard dog training. He complained that he didn't want his dog to enjoy other dogs. He wanted his dog to avoid them.  traciels28 wrote: Of course Hudson was the social butterfly of the class who never once looked up at me while I called him. Hence, he is about to begin round six of obedience. Sounds exactly like Tiggy. traciels28 wrote: Rudy's going to his first class on Monday, too. I predict by the end of this round, Rudy will be in the lead behaviourally. Good on you Rudy!!! |
| Our puppy kindergarten class was a mixture of supervised play (nothing too rough or intimidating but bouncy fun was allowed), attention-requiring exercises, and calm-requiring exercises. And they could play before and after. Henry and I both loved it. That was for puppies 8-16 weeks. After 16 weeks was level 1 puppy class and that was more structured with play just for a few minutes at the beginning and middle of the class. The pups that I saw go through that program have all become really good, happy, well-socialized dogs. |
| Frankie has been to many classes. Some were play for 10 mins before, then some training then more play. Others were more structured where if they even made a peep they were to be reprimanded. The class we are in now, the trainer lets Frankie play with a couple of the younger pups who don't get any play time at home with other dogs, at the very end of class. Frankie is also a social butterfly and loves to play all sizes of dogs.
Lisa and Frankie |
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