Lola Again
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| I'm so sorry that you're going through this right now! How horrible!! Wendel, Asterisk, and I will send as many good vibes and well-wishes that we can to you and Lola. |
| I can't imagine what you are going through, I'm so sorry. Paws crossed for Lola. |
| I'm so sorry to hear you and Lola are going through this. How old is she? From a few articles I've read it usually shows symptoms by 6 months of age....
Here's one: http://www.upei.ca/~cidd/Diseases/cardiovascular%20diseases/portosystemic%20shunt.htm |
| She is almost 8 months old. |
LolasMama wrote: She is almost 8 months old.
 I'm so sorry. This must be so scary for you all.
As for the shunts, lots of dogs are diagnosed later than six months. Less serious cases are some times not diagnosed till the dog is an adult; at least in some dogs, mostly larger breed, I think. I know a lab who was 4 1/2 y.o when she was diagnosed and she's still doing fine last I heard. The bile acid test is not that expensive, though on top of your recent vet bills I'm sure that's little consolation. Still, if you (what does you vet say?) seriously suspect liver shunts it's probably worth ruling that in or out. If yes, it's my understanding that the type OES tend to have are generally inopererable. But there are some things you can do (low protein diet under vet's supervision, supplements to support the liver and maybe even some medications? Not sure, but your vet will know) to try to limit the toxin build-up in her system and manage/control the symptoms. And if the bile acid test comes back OK, you know you're probably looking at something else. How long after she ate did the vomiting/seizure occur? Has she been eating well since you got her home? Before her last episode? And what is her energy level like? You had her spayed not too long ago, yes? How did she handle being put under? Did they happen to do basic bloodwork before they did the surgery? Just pieces of the puzzle I'm sure your vet has already considered. Kristine |
| We recently switched vets and the vet we saw is not there today. As for the bile acid test, it is around $100 and I can do that.
I am not completely sure she had a seizure. We cam downstairs to the crate full of potty smeared around and vomited blood. Because of the feces, I assume seizure, although there was no slimy clear goo his time. Her blanket had patches of blood all over it. She does have a bit of residue blood in her mouth, so I know it came from there. Since she came home last time, she has been our miracle baby. Happy and normal. She eats well, but she does drink a lot of water. I have not taken her to the vet again this time yet because they did nothing last time but watch her all night, run basic blood tests and charge us $1100. The vomiting and seizure (if she had one) happened several hours after her last meal. She also is not small, or normally lethargic. I am only thinking shunt because I can't imagine what else. I only have two other theories: We get the premium food from Costco. We had briefly switched to the Chicken and rice because it was rated higher. Lolas potty was not great on it. Pretty runny so we switched back to Lamb & Rice. Yesterday we were at the bottom of the food barrel and she ended up with primarily chicken and rice. I would wonder if the food was tainted, but we have three other dogs who are fine. We have thrown it out though and put back ONLY lamb and rice. My second theory is that I gave her a bath last night with a lavender dog shampoo I bought in Sonoma. I have used it on one of my other dogs and she was fine. The only difference is that Lola probably gets a lot more in her mouth because of cleaning her beard. Her response to her anesthesia was fine after her spay. Another vote in the 'not shunt' category. She had blood work done during her last episode and it was all within limits. The only thing even close to not being was one of her blood counts (i forget which) was 1 point over normal. I am truly mystified. My poor baby is resting on the tile breathing heavy and trying not to look too miserable |
So you haven't actually seen her have a seizure? Ever? (Or did she have one with the presumed poison plant eating episode? So many sick OES lately, my head is swimming, sorry  )
But if you didn't see one, that could be good news. OES are fully capable of smearing bodily fluids to hell and back while fully conscious  Never mind if she was trying to get away from the results of her being sick.
It could "just" be something seriously off kilter related to her gut. That's not necessarily good, but odds are a lot less bad than a shunt.... Thinking positive thoughts here. 
Kristine |
| I saw a seizure the first go round as did the vet. This time I have not witnessed one, just assumed it because of the potty. She completely recovered from the last episode. It all pointed to something toxic. I just don't know what to think. |
Although I can't explain the blood, I have come home to quite a few well decorated crates in my time - and they get runny from stress so it makes it worse. DO you have a vet you can talk to over the phone? I alsways foud that to be a good approach, becasue they can digest some of the info between talking to you and seeing the dog. and yess with seizures it is a watching game - same as with people and idiopathic seizures.
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| I wish I did have a vet I could just call. They don't work like that here. My Yorkie has kennel cough (that we brought home on Lola from the vets most likely) but I don't know if that could have anything to do with this. I heard Lola cough once the other day. Last time there was a huge amount of blood she vomited. This time it doesn't seem like as much. She still seems to be having labored breathing, but when she relax's laying down I can't hear it for the most part. She is still wandering around the house. Last time she was gorked out. Her gums are nice and pink as well. Last time they were pretty pale. |
| We are back at the vet. Lola had a huge seizure. Say a prayer for my baby girl please. |
LolasMama wrote: We are back at the vet. Lola had a huge seizure. Say a prayer for my baby girl please.
Oh, geez. I'm so sorry.
Kristine |
| Our prayers are all to Lola. Get better baby girl. |
| My prayers are with Lola .
From me and Marls |
| Prayers for Lola and for you too. |
| She had another HUGE seizure at the vets. Here is where we are at: Everyone is confused because she has blood in her lungs. Probably more than can be explained by aspirating during a seizure. We are going to treat her like she has epilepsy. She is at the vets on IV valium and is going to start on a weeks worth of phenobarbital. If she makes it through that we will titer it back and see if she is seizure free. If she is and stays that way we may just assume that some freaky thing messed her up. If after cutting down the PB, she starts having seizures again, we will assume she is epileptic. Then we will look towards what meds we want to use to manage it. If the PB doesn’t work we have to go with that she has a tumor in or near her lungs that is bleeding when she seizes. The bottom line is that if after a week on drugs she is still seizing, we will have to consider putting her down. The diagnostics to satisfy our curiosity would run in to the thousands and all they would do is tell us exactly why our dog is suffering. It would most likely result in the need to put her down anyway. I have been crying all day. I just pray we all make it through this. |
| So sorry to hear all this. Poor Lola and you!
Thinking of you! |
| This is absolutely heartbreaking I am so sorry, please give Lola a gentle hug. My family is thinking of you
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| My heart and prayers go out to you and to Lola. You WILL make it through. You are doing the best you can. I am almost hoping its epilepsy. I believe from your post and from my knowledge of the human disease, it is treatable with medication. I know people can live a normal life as long as they stay on the meds.
I don't see any point in spending thousands to find out why things are happening that can't be fixed any way. You have to resolve in your heart you are doing the best possible for Lola. God bless you and your family and prayers are out to little Lola. Diane |
| Thanks everyone. I am just trying to tell myself that even if we only get to have her for a short time, she was/is loved and she knows it. I can't say as much for her first 6 months of life. She has been a princess in our house. Lily (our retriever) is devastated. She is wandering around the house not knowing what to do with herself. She and Lola are best friends. When they sleep near each other during the day, Lola has to be touching some part of Lily, even if it is just the tip of her tail. They are usually all wound up in each other. If we have to do the unthinkable, I will send Lola to doggy day camp for a day here and there to keep her busy. |
| Lola is home for the night. She is a little loopy from the valium. We are starting her on 2 antibiotics, anti-seizure & prednisone. We'll see how she does. Her breathing is still very shallow.
Correction: I meant Lily, up above. I would send Lily to doggy day camp. Ya'll I am so tiiiirrreeeedddd... |
| I hope your vet can figure this out . I know it's hard but try to take care of yourself as best you can |
| to you and Lola and the whole family. This sounds horrible for all of you.
I hope your vet figures something out, and that it is a workable solution. |
| All my best wishes for you and sweet Lola |
| It's so hard to see our beloved furry companions ill or in pain. Lola's very
fortunate to have such a loving family. I hope the medications will help. |
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From our family to yours |
Well, Lola made it through the night. She doesn't want to lay down though. She just wanders panting for air. I am hoping she is not in pain, just short of breath. I know Lola is still in there somewhere. When she saw Lily this morning, she got wxcited and then promptly had to gasp for air. She just tried to take a sip of my tea too.  She's in there. No seizures or vomiting. Let's just hope the breathing gets better. |
| What did the vet say about the difficulty breathing? Panting could be a sign of pain. But it could also be a sign of many things. Did the vet give you any treatment plan or anything?
Still sending prayers out to you all. |
| We are assuming that the panting is all the fluid in her lungs. She is on 4 different drugs. We are treating it as epilepsy. The biggest concern is that every time she has a seizure, her lungs fill with blood. We can't really explain that. |
| This is off of PETMD.com:
Noncardiogenic edema is caused by an increased permeability of the blood vessels of the lungs. Permeability is the ability to pass through, as by osmosis. Increased permeability results in the leakage of fluid into the lung, causing edema, or swelling. If this becomes severe, the edema may be accompanied by an inflammatory response and an accumulation of inflammatory cells in the lung. There are several factors which can cause changes in the permeability of the lung’s blood vessels. Dogs that have edema as a result of a brain disorder, from a response to an electric cord bite injury, or from an upper airway obstruction might experience a systemic release of catecholamines (neurotransmitters and hormones). This release would lead to a causative effect, with systemic constriction of blood vessels shunting blood into the lungs and overloading the blood vessels of the lung, damaging them, and leading to inflammation and swelling of the lungs. How could the vet NOT know this??? |
| I am traveling and just popped on for a minute--I am so sorry that Lola is going through this.
Lola and your entire family are in my thoughts and prayers. |
| We took Lola back in for a quick look. We have just started her on Lasix as well. Still no seizures. |
LolasMama wrote: This is off of PETMD.com:
Noncardiogenic edema is caused by an increased permeability of the blood vessels of the lungs. Permeability is the ability to pass through, as by osmosis. Increased permeability results in the leakage of fluid into the lung, causing edema, or swelling. If this becomes severe, the edema may be accompanied by an inflammatory response and an accumulation of inflammatory cells in the lung. There are several factors which can cause changes in the permeability of the lung’s blood vessels. Dogs that have edema as a result of a brain disorder, from a response to an electric cord bite injury, or from an upper airway obstruction might experience a systemic release of catecholamines (neurotransmitters and hormones). This release would lead to a causative effect, with systemic constriction of blood vessels shunting blood into the lungs and overloading the blood vessels of the lung, damaging them, and leading to inflammation and swelling of the lungs. How could the vet NOT know this??? I know you've been back to the vet now. But he may have known this but is trying to figure out whether the blood in the lungs is due to seizures or whether the seizures are due to the other problems with lungs etc. I hope that your vet can figure it out soon and its something that is treatable. How is Lola? Is she breathing any easier? How are you? |
Mim wrote: LolasMama wrote: This is off of PETMD.com: Noncardiogenic edema is caused by an increased permeability of the blood vessels of the lungs. Permeability is the ability to pass through, as by osmosis. Increased permeability results in the leakage of fluid into the lung, causing edema, or swelling. If this becomes severe, the edema may be accompanied by an inflammatory response and an accumulation of inflammatory cells in the lung. There are several factors which can cause changes in the permeability of the lung’s blood vessels. Dogs that have edema as a result of a brain disorder, from a response to an electric cord bite injury, or from an upper airway obstruction might experience a systemic release of catecholamines (neurotransmitters and hormones). This release would lead to a causative effect, with systemic constriction of blood vessels shunting blood into the lungs and overloading the blood vessels of the lung, damaging them, and leading to inflammation and swelling of the lungs. How could the vet NOT know this??? I know you've been back to the vet now. But he may have known this but is trying to figure out whether the blood in the lungs is due to seizures or whether the seizures are due to the other problems with lungs etc. I hope that your vet can figure it out soon and its something that is treatable. How is Lola? Is she breathing any easier? How are you? He says that it is very rare for that to happen, but he doesn't what else it could be. Lola is breathing a little easier and is able to lay down now and rest. Thank God. Watching her stand for hours was draining. We are doing fine. My husband and I have come to terms with what is happening. We are hoping for the best and preparing for the worst. |
| Mentioning the drug Lasisk...could she be having congestitive heartt failure? Not to second guess the Vet, I know you said it wasn't the usual vet you use. is there a specialisit or er vetinary hopsital nearby? They are wonderful and will do all thetesting right then and there. If you can not afford the testing, many will help with time payments or discounted rates. worth a visit...I don't think eplilipsy would cause this breathing problem...
Is there any way she could have swallowed something blocking her throat air ways???Or could something be stuck in the esophogus or a blockage of some type..I'm having difficulty with the diagnosis of EP with these other symptoms... Hope she feels better soon...Can't imagine the stress you are going through. Stay strong... |
Ashley wrote: Mentioning the drug Lasisk...could she be having congestitive heartt failure? Not to second guess the Vet, I know you said it wasn't the usual vet you use. is there a specialisit or er vetinary hopsital nearby? They are wonderful and will do all thetesting right then and there. If you can not afford the testing, many will help with time payments or discounted rates. worth a visit...I don't think eplilipsy would cause this breathing problem...
Is there any way she could have swallowed something blocking her throat air ways???Or could something be stuck in the esophogus or a blockage of some type..I'm having difficulty with the diagnosis of EP with these other symptoms... Hope she feels better soon...Can't imagine the stress you are going through. Stay strong... This is her normal vet. Last time this happened we had her at the Vet Hospital. They were clueless as well. My vet doesn't feel it it epilepsy 100% either, but we just want to get her stabilized. Since I rescued Lola, we have over $2400 in to her. I just can't put out much more. We are just not in a position to obligate ourselves to more payments. The breathing is what has everyone stymied. Her heart sounds fine and her xrays show fluid in the lungs, but her heart is not enlarged. What is also confusing is her absolute 100% recovery last time. Our vet even called two specialists and they were at a loss as well. Her blood work is also completely normal which is baffling as well. I am hoping it was an allergy to the old food or something. We are just taking it day by day. We finally got her to eat. Scrambled eggs. Yay! She is also improving to the point where she is not having to mouth breath all the time. That is a relief as well. |
| Is she on meds for seizures???
Just asking as our last OES that passed should have been. I kept telling the vet he was having seizures and she was thinking it wasn't. Just a thought to ask your vet. If you coudl try Phenobarb or Potasium Bromide. Good Luck! |
Donner's Mom wrote: Is she on meds for seizures???
Yes, she is on Phenobarbital. |
This is Lola just a couple of days before she started seizing again. She looks so healthy...
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| Boy, I sure am sorry for all you are going through. I love the pictures of her. So cute. |
| Well, Lolas recovery has again been miraculous. She is is panting a bit, but is playful and her old self. Not as bouncy as her breathing won't allow for it, but as bouncy as she CAN be.
I am feeling a little more optimistic as I don't believe a bleeding tumor would resolve itself over and over. I just don't know what to think. My brain hurts from trying to figure it out. For now, I am just happy Lola is on the mend. |
Yes! That's very good news 
And what a lovely picture 
Hugs to you and your baby. |
LolasMama wrote: Donner's Mom wrote: Is she on meds for seizures??? Yes, she is on Phenobarbital. Sorry, I missed that somehow 
Glad she is perking up... We found with our two that had seizures that is was very important to keep them cool. In fact they both always slept in front of a fan! |
| There was ALOT to read!
We are keeping our air conditioning at 72. She kept trying to go in the backyard and lay down in the sun in 107 degree weather. Needless to say we strenuously discouraged THAT!  |
| Lola is beautiful My heart is breaking for you. It is just so hard when they are ill and we cannot help. I am sending good thoughts your way |
| Do youhave central a/c or room a/c? If you have room a/c, maybe you can keep one room super cold just for Lola? And did you sat 107 degrees??? Yikes! In our area, when it gets over 90, and that's been the last few weeks, I keep the a'c much lower so it stays cool. Seems if I keep it at a regular temp, during the heat of the day it just doesn't cool off. we have centrl a/c so I cant just keep one room ice cold...
If the laski is woring, I would tend to thin her heart may be a problem and not the EP....Watch her sodium count. Amazing how much sodium is in their food and more in their treats. Keeping the sodum donw goes a BIG way towards helping the breathing. By the way, the Lasik may increase urination Just to keep in mind!
Hope Lola continues to do well...Also, I know you took her as a rescue resource...Can the rescue help with the medical bills or future testing at all? Just wondering... Our thouughts and prayers are staying with you and your fmaily and Lola... Diane and Gang |
Ashley wrote: Do youhave central a/c or room a/c? If you have room a/c, maybe you can keep one room super cold just for Lola? And did you sat 107 degrees??? Yikes! In our area, when it gets over 90, and that's been the last few weeks, I keep the a'c much lower so it stays cool. Seems if I keep it at a regular temp, during the heat of the day it just doesn't cool off. we have centrl a/c so I cant just keep one room ice cold...
If the laski is woring, I would tend to thin her heart may be a problem and not the EP....Watch her sodium count. Amazing how much sodium is in their food and more in their treats. Keeping the sodum donw goes a BIG way towards helping the breathing. By the way, the Lasik may increase urination Just to keep in mind!Hope Lola continues to do well...Also, I know you took her as a rescue resource...Can the rescue help with the medical bills or future testing at all? Just wondering... Our thouughts and prayers are staying with you and your fmaily and Lola... Diane and Gang We only have central air. I am not worried, she is doing awesome. Isn't lasix a diuretic? Wouldn't it work regardless the cause of the fluid in the lungs? I didn't get her from a rescue per say, I rescued her from some idiots. We actually PAID for her to get her away from them. They had her in full sheepie hair locked in a kennel with no shade in 100+ degrees. We had to shave her she was so matted. She also had severe ear infections and was in heat. Oh, and when she was x-rayed for all of this, we found a bb in her hip. Cool, huh? 
Oh, and we are letting her out to pee CONSTANTLY. Having taken diuretics myself, I can appreciate her needs. 
PS: Today is 109. |
| Either way you rescued her and she is lucky you did!
We have central ac but, we had to get a window unit in the den to keep it super cool for Donner but, he had more issues than seizures too! Plus his fan....this is why even when it is 100 out I still alot of times can be spotted in flannel!
Glad she is doing better.... I do have ALOT of phenobarb left from Paddy Paws...if she stays on it you are welcome to it but, I am not sure if I can mail it??? It is 64.8 mg btw Crossing paws for continued good health! |
| Thank you so much for your generosity! I am hoping that if we have to keep her on anti-seizure meds, that we can switch her to Potassium Bromide. We'll see what happens. I know that we will probably keep her on meds at least until we get from vacation. |
| So glad to hear that Lola is doing better. that she continues to improve! |
| Ya'll are NOT going to believe this. This is Lola TODAY: PS: We forced her to rest after this. |
| WOOP WOOP!
way to go Lola! She looks great! |
Yay way to go Lola. 
Lily looks so happy to have her playmate back. |
Mim wrote: Yay way to go Lola.
Lily looks so happy to have her playmate back. You have no idea. She was harassing the poodle and the yorkie. SOMEBODY was going to play with her. LOL |
| Woohoohoo!
Oh, this makes me sooo happy
I really hope this was just a bump in the road for your beautiful girl. |
| It's just so bizarre though, isn't it? Not once but TWICE, this has happened. I am trying not to get my hopes up. That was partly what was so devastating last time, we were completely blindsided. I am taking it one day at a time and enjoying every moment of her health. |
| What a great video!!! Thank you for sharing Lola's miraculous recovery..She is an inspiration (as you are) to all of us!!!
Keep staying strong!!! Both of you!!! So happy that Lola is continuing her miracles!!!!! |
| Took Lola to the vet. He is amazed as well. We should have called her Phoenix. He says that the fact that she recovers so quickly point to juvenile epilepsy. We still don't understand why her lungs get fluid in them. He did say that anything he could think of that could cause that independently, she wouldn't recover from so fast, if at all. Her age is definitely on her side. |
What a great recovery! Hope she continues to improve  |
| So happy for you and Lola! Hope she continues to improve! |
| For all of you Lola well wishers and watchers, this is for you.... |
Yay Lola!! 
Cant believe she was so sick so recently. |
| Amazing dog! She definately lives day to day.......no thinking about yesterday. |
| If only we could do the same. <sigh> |
| Wonder if she has any cats in her breeding, nine lives and all |
| wow way to go lola this is your first sheepy well that are tuff girls!! |
| That looks like so much fun. Lola and Lily are lucky girls! |
| That is just amazing, Gina. I can't believe that she was doing so poorly when looking at that video. Talk about a miraculous recovery! |
| What's so amazing is that it was 1 week to the day from her last seizure. We had been discussing options for putting her down. I am still praying that it is 'just' epilepsy and that we can continue to give her a great quality of life. |
| Oh, and ANOTHER miracle: our crazy Lola was GOLD at the beach. I had been so worried about her recall. She was 100% dependable. I am STUNNED. I had visions of chasing her down the beach. |
| She looks great! And so happy! I think you should be thrilled it is "just eplipsy". Because epilepsy is very controllable and people/dogs with it can live a very normal, long life with the help of medication.
I remember she was on Lasik as well? And I believe that is for the fluid that gathers in her lungs? You might want to start watching her sodium intake. There is sooo much sodium in foods - people too. I don't know what the recommended amount is for dogs but you can ask the Vet and see what he thinks. I know from previous human experience too much sodium can be a problem with fluid build up in the lungs causing trouble breathing, tiredness, etc. Lola is truly the miracle dog and you are a hero for the care you are giving her |
| Trust me, I am thrilled! We adore this goofy girl. She hasn't had any treats or people food since her last 'episode'. I am afraid to give her anything. I will look into the sodium content of her food.
I don't know if the Lasix really did anything. She recovered exactly the same as the time before when she had no Lasix. It is all still so confusing. |
| What a wonderful video. Two very happy furkids! |
| Absolutely thrilled to see and hear of Lola's recovery! And bless you for giving her a wonderful home and the life she deseves. |
| Thanks so much everyone. I love doing the videos. It makes me feel hopeful. |
| what a happy couple of friends, so good to see Lola feeling better |
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