Sheepdog Markings
Before we got her we had wanted one with patches on the face. But now I am debating whether the new puppy should look like Sammy or one with completely different markings. I'm afraid if the new puppy has Sammy's markings I would be constantly reminded that she is not with me any longer. Also how rare are walleyes? I'd love to look into one or two blue eyes like Sid on the forum. He is absolutely gorgeous and mesmerizing. I hope this doesn't sound too shallow talking about markings. Honestly, I'd be in 7th heaven to have any OES sheepie. 
Loving and Missing my Sweet Sammy Girl  |
|
|
| I always think its best if you look for the dog and not the markings JMHO. |
I have no idea what the answer is, but I actually found more dogs with a white face when I was looking than ones with markings on the face. I totally was looking for a dog with either 2 black ears or 2 black eyes (2 black front legs would have been a bonus)  I knew what all I wanted in a dog and markings did play a role despite everyone telling me it shouldn't.
You should go with your gut! I just knew I had been looking/dreaming of my second dog for so long, I didn't want to regret my decision. I guess after seeing so many pictures of cuties on here, you have an idea of what you prefer more. While I would have been happy if the dog didn't have something I wanted (appearance), I'd be in the same position I've been in with every dog I've owned (loving them to pieces but wishing they had more show qualities), SO I stuck to what I wanted. I almost didn't b/c a breeder really had me sold on this white dog, but once I met up with the breeder I chose and saw mequpak ...I fell in love (more my husband ...and it was him that said he didn't want the original dog we had in mind). I talked to several breeders while I was looking for a dog recently, and once I explained what all I was looking for, they ALL told me they felt there was nothing wrong with wanting what I wanted, but made sure I knew it may take awhile (a few litters) to get it. That made me feel better. They just said they don't like hearing that from first time owners and if that was ALL they were looking for in the dog. |
Let me preface this with some tea  , and ...because I mean it in the friendliest possible way  ...
I think you need to stop focusing so much on comparisons of this (as yet non-existent) pup to Sammy. The most important considerations for a new puppy buyer (in my opinion) should be:1- finding a good, reputable breeder (and you may need to get on a waiting list...so start early) 2-making sure that all the proper health checks to the parents etc are documented, and 3-choosing a pup whose temperament will fit in with your household. I agree with Joahaeyo, that you need to go with your "gut" instincts...but...Im a bit concerned that you might be tempted to go with a not-so-great breeder, if a pup who fits your ideal happens to be available. This new pup will be a whole new, unique individual...no matter what he/she looks like...trust us on this. Ok...that's my lecture for the day  |
| Remember puppies don't keep the tuxedo look forever. They turn grey and all the black and white face, legs, etc isn't as noticeable when you are dealing with grey and white.
Some folks feel there is a difference in grooming between grey and white hair. Wall eyes are not as common as brown, but do occur. First and foremost should be sound structure/health over markings. Don't let your design ideals mess with getting the best possible puppy you can. Your little beauty might turn out to be a medical nightmare. |
| Dont obssess about markings, eye colour or which sex. What is most important is getting a Healthy OES puppy from a reputable breeder that has health tested, dogs have good temperament (ie Sire and Dam of the litter) and speaking with the breeder on your requirements, ie what sort of lifestyle you lead and what sort of personality in a pup would be suitable for you.
There your priorities more so then markings etc. Whitehead or patching really does not matter, you seem to get either in a litter. My personal favourite is the double eye and ear patching. We were lucky enough to have one but he went off to NZ. Two brown eyes are the most common, followed by a wall (one Brown, One blue) and 2 blues are not very common. There not bred to produce 2 blues as the other eye colours are preferred although 2 blue is allowable in the standard. After 30+ years of this line, first time we have ever had a 2 blue eyed. Did not keep him for that reason as prefer two dark dark brown, he was going to be a pet for hubby to run with and also before we knew eye colour hubby bonded with him and wanted to keep him. He turned out better then what I thought conformation wise so that was just an extra added bonus with keeping him. Also at the time non of the puppy people wanted 2 blues on an OES so another reason he stayed. Never been a fan of 2 blues but his nature and sweetness is what I have fallen in love with. For years I only had girls he has stolen my heart big time, not because of his eyes just for what he is like, a goofball and a big cuddle bug.
So your priorities should be firstly getting in contact through the OESCA with reputable breeders and getting on a waiting list then proceeding from there in checking out potential puppies. Dont go BYB as cheap can also mean huge expense later on health wise. |
| Wow I didn't realize I was going to get a lecture. I asked a simple question about markings. I am not a newbie looking for a designer dog. Of course I know that the most important consideration is healthy sound dogs from conscientious breeders. Sammy's dad was Am/Cdn Ch Raffles Just Ewe Wait, the great Higgins from Canada. I had to beg his breeder to let us have one of his pups. Believe me I went through the wringer before she agreed. I had to bring my boys to meet with her. She matched Sammy to our family and her judgement was right on. Sammy was the only pet in her litter of six. All her littermates became champion show dogs
So I do know the process. I didn't expect how judgemental people can be. Maybe I am "obsessing" about the new OES in our lives but I thought if anyone would understand what I have gone through losing Sammy it would be people in this forum. I've been told by many people to stop "obsessing" about Sammy so I really don't need to be told that here. I'm afraid to ask any more questions.  |
| ^^^
That's how I felt when looking for a puppy again. I kept thinking, jeez... I've been on here HOW long and I still have to state the obvious (many times and with as many of the details I knew they wanted to hear) before even mentioning I want a dog with certain markings?
Of course I cared about breeder and personality which is why I was glad the people I talked to about their litters (all on the approved list) all said they understood/can be the same way about a dog or simply said they could make it happen for me. In the end, I know they mean well, so I just took it in ...in silence, and still did what I wanted. I think we (been guilty myself) get concerned new posters saying stuff like that in fear they'll end up with a dog they don't want and it end up in the pound. |
| Poolmom -- I think you received good advice with kindest intentions. It may not be what you wanted to hear but it was hardly judgmental. I wish you could re-read the responses in the positive, helpful tone that I am sure was intended. You asked the question so I don't know why you should be surprised or dismayed to receive a variety of responses. |
| No one means to be critical but you do have to start afresh, we all miss our babies that have to leave us, I am still heart broken about my older girl I lost this year but you have to clear your mind by no comparisons as this will be a new start with a completely different OES to start making a new fun life together. Sammy was unique as is each and everyone of them, but a new one will instill in you something very unique and different to how you and sammy were together.
Believe me I know what you are going through, I wish I could of cloned Kelsey to have a girl just like her, but you cant live in the past you have to move on. 
Yes markings and eye colour can determine what you want or are interested in, but dont make that a priority, see if you can view a litter, usually if lucky there is a few that you can choose from under the breeders guidence. |
| We are not being judgemental. We want the best possible dog for you. Continue to ask questions.....we are just trying to steer you to the best decision.
Many of us have seen people pick a dog for the wrong reasons, preconceived ideals or just plain ignorance and when the dog changed, they got rid of it. We applaud you taking your time but ask that you be careful. |
| Lots of great advice, a lot of people desire a certain marking or lack of markings and end up picking a pup that may be the total opposite because they are drawn to a personality....
Health and temperment are number one, so ask lots of questions, and remember that even if you want "just a pet" not to be thrown off by breeders who show. Those of us who show and are lucky enough to have a litter would be even luckier still to have one or two show quality pups, the rest are "pet pups" and whether they are shown or not we all just want the best possible home for them |
| Im sorry that replies that I, and other folks gave you seemed judgmental to you. Seriously...I (and many others on here) know what you are going though. I also wasnt thinking so much in terms of you not knowing what to look for in a breeder/puppy, but that perhaps your focus at the moment seems so much to be on issues of comparison with Sammy.
Please don't stop asking questions...I read back though all the replies, and honestly see no unkind intent in any of them. |
kerry wrote: I always think its best if you look for the dog and not the markings JMHO.
THANK YOU! |
| I never said I was going to use markings to pick my next sheepie. I was just excited about the possibilities. A person can't dream? Everyone has a preference to start out with and of course it is taken into consideration along with all the other factors.
I don't know why I need to defend my question. |
| well I think what people are saying is that your preference should be for a heatlthy pet, not markings. One of the issues is many less than reputable breeders market their dogs based on white heads or blue eyes, so I think some responded to your question based on that framework. |
| I don't think anyone here was being judgmental, just very passionate about the sheepies we all love.
Jenny is my third sheepie and for me this time around, a very reputable breeder and temperament first and the fact that Jenny has a white head and one wall eye was an added bonus. My first two females we very hyper and I knew that I didn't want that this time around. We were naive with our first two and now we realize they people we got them from were just BYB. Don't get me wrong they were good dogs and were very much loved an spoiled, I guess I am just trying to say that to us, because of having a summer home, temperament was the most important thing to us. Nothing wrong with wanting a white head or blue eyes, I just wouldn't want to deal with someone who breeds solely for that purpose, because you have the potential for all kinds of health issues. Good luck in your search for your new puppy. |
| I understand your question and can relate to it. My first OES lived to be almost 15. We were active in everything, earned an obedience title CD, went on to the higher CDX title and did therapy in nursing homes, etc. When I had to put him down it was the worst day of my life and even today, almost 15 years later, I have his pictures in frames scattered throughout the house...
When it was time to get my next dog, and I waited many years ( for reasons not related to grieving), I was afraid I would always compare the "new" one to my first one. My first one had a white head and brown eyes. For ehatever reason, I preferred a white head. I waited almost a year to get my new pup - and yes, it was through the OES Club breeder referral list. That was two and a half years ago and now I have yet a third OES from the same breeder. The older one has a wall eye and the younger one has brown and they both have basically all white heads like my first. Do I compare them? Honestly, sometimes I do. I think its a natural tendency. But I love them all the same and they nall have their own personality traits. If you had an OES in the past, you are already familiar with how important temperment is and training, you already know the high maintenance and the high activity level. I don't see anything wrong with preferring one marking over another. You've been there before. You already know health and temperment are top priorities. Why be ashamed to say you perfer a specific marking if there's a choice? Good luck with the puppy hunt... |
poolmom wrote: Are white face sheepies more rare? Yes. Quote: Sammy had a beautiful white face and whithers and white socks on the hind legs. So cute. Like Sammy was a little girl in a fursuit, eh? Quote: Before we got her we had wanted one with patches on the face. But now I am debating whether the new puppy should look like Sammy.... Funny, when I started looking I was looking for a snowcap because that is what my previous sheepie was. Betsy has one black eye and ear but her show side is white. I have come to love having the best of both worlds. Quote: ...or one with completely different markings. I'm afraid if the new puppy has Sammy's markings I would be constantly reminded that she is not with me any longer. I am guessing probably not, assuming you are getting a puppy. The puppy will have the tuxedo look and not look like a mature adult. By the time the puppy grows up, it will surely only remind you of that puppy as their personalities are always completely different. Quote: Also how rare are walleyes? I'd love to look into one or two blue eyes....
Sorry, I don't know the answer. I see a lot of dogs at shows, but I rarely see their eyes as the poof-look obscures them. I am always focused on movement. I have the opportunity to put my hands on quite a few sheepies and it is amazing how they vary, pedigrees aside. There are a variety of issues in selecting your next pup. Health and temperament were key for me. And I couldn't love that little face anymore than I do if she was snowcapped. I was lucky enough to buy her from someone who was breeding for her self. She did all the health tests and has no cancer and sound temperament in her lines. The rest is the DNA crapshoot. But I know I have done everything possible to make certain my baby will be healthy so that we can share a long life together. As you know, losing your best friend is one of the hardest things ever and something I want to put off for a very long time. You have my sincerest condolences on your loss. Good luck on your puppy search. Soon you too can go through the joy of teething, shredded paper, housebreaking and all the great stuff that comes with a new pup.  |
poolmom wrote: Are white face sheepies more rare? Sammy had a beautiful white face and whithers and white socks on the hind legs.
Before we got her we had wanted one with patches on the face. But now I am debating whether the new puppy should look like Sammy or one with completely different markings. I'm afraid if the new puppy has Sammy's markings I would be constantly reminded that she is not with me any longer. Also how rare are walleyes? I'd love to look into one or two blue eyes like Sid on the forum. He is absolutely gorgeous and mesmerizing. I hope this doesn't sound too shallow talking about markings. Honestly, I'd be in 7th heaven to have any OES sheepie. Loving and Missing my Sweet Sammy Girl I know what you mean about losing an OES and wanting another one that looks similar but are afraid to compare. There is NOTHING wrong with what you are asking. To be completely blunt, there is nothing wrong with having a preference of OES' markings. However, I feel that you should base what you are looking for simply because you love the breed. I mean, you are searching for another OES so what does that tell you!!! After reading all of the previous posts I can see you are experienced with the breed.... If this makes ANY sense, I lost my tortie cat after 18 years this past march. And I am absolutely in love with long haired tortie cats. I would like another one when the time is right, but I must admit, I think that if I get another one it will remind me a lot of Kaluha. I don't want to get another kitty in hopes of being reminded of her as it's not really right or fair to the new kitty......I don't want to have a new baby in the house to get reminded of something so precious it could never be replaced....It's very tough and I do understand what you are trying to say..... All I can say is, do what you feel is right in your heart. Remember 90% of the time, the animal usually chooses the human |
| Ashley, Quailtrail and I Dream of Sheepie:
Thank you so much for your responses. Those are exactly the kind I was asking for. Perhaps I didn't articulate my question as well as I should. I am beginning my puppy search still grieving for my doggie soulmate so of course she is on my mind when I asked those questions. Be assured I know what the important criteria are in choosing my new puppy. And when he or she finally comes into my life it will be a most joyous occasion. Peace and Love |
| A funny thing happened this weekend - my daughter was home and the she and the dogs and I were watching TV late at night. Before I tell it I have to remind those who may not remember (or know or care) that I got the M&M's in 2005 after losing my first sheepdog Max in 2004.
So, we are watching some rerun on TV and Morgan was passed out on the floor. Marley was besides her self trying to decide who to play up to - me or Jess. When she gets that way she can do that sheepdog thing, on her back wriggling - I am sure you all are familiar with it. Being the indulgent "mom" I sort of laughed at her and went back to watching TV. Jess on the other hand doesn't spend a lot of time with the dogs, she lives 6 hours away now and was all the way in Florida while they were puppies. She took one look at Marley and said "oh look - Max!" Max was a very dark masked dog, Marley has one partially dark ear and is light silver in color - I don't see any physical similarities. But I guess the essence is still there. I have to say I never have any "oh look Max minutes" but I guess they happen and I just don't really notice them anymore. I am sure your new sheepdog will find its own way into your heart. |
| Isn't amazing if people would take care to breed as well as these champions are bred, we wouldnt be so sickly then again a lot of us wouldnt even exsist. |
| We bought Walter from a bad breeder, which I will forever feel bad about. We got pictures online and got to pick our puppy out. I wanted a pup with a patch on his eye, but my dad insisted we get Walter because his markings were exactly like our first OES Shaggy, who was the perfect dog. Little did we know we were picking out a monster!! We joke all the time about how we should have taken the pup with the patch |
| I have been asked a few times lately about eyes!
We have two double wall eyed babies here and two walleyed....(not baby babies) The new foster coming in is also double wall eyed... It seems like I run into it all the time and although my little boys baby blues make me melt
I had always prefered dark brown! I guess that doesn't answer any questions at all but, just adding we come across it quiet often! ANYWAY Good Luck in your search for a puppy |
| I will admit. I have an ideal of what I am looking for in my future OES pup. I want eye patches, or black ears and either blue eyes or one blue and one brown. It is a wish list if you will. It is what I see in my head when I dream of my future doggy. In the same way that while I was pregnant I would dream of what my babies might look like. While a healthy baby was always the utmost and ultimately all that mattered, dreaming is just part of the process, IMO.
When it comes time for me to pick my furbaby health, breeding, disposition and most importantly what my heart tells me will be my determining factors but I certainly don't feel guilty that I hope that all those things will still equal my pup to look the way I dreamt he/she would look. Much as I was very pleased when my babies came out with full heads of hair vs bald. It doesn't really matter but it was a delightful surprise! |
angie wrote: I will admit. I have an ideal of what I am looking for in my future OES pup. I want eye patches, or black ears and either blue eyes or one blue and one brown. It is a wish list if you will. It is what I see in my head when I dream of my future doggy. In the same way that while I was pregnant I would dream of what my babies might look like. While a healthy baby was always the utmost and ultimately all that mattered, dreaming is just part of the process, IMO.
When it comes time for me to pick my furbaby health, breeding, disposition and most importantly what my heart tells me will be my determining factors but I certainly don't feel guilty that I hope that all those things will still equal my pup to look the way I dreamt he/she would look. Much as I was very pleased when my babies came out with full heads of hair vs bald. It doesn't really matter but it was a delightful surprise! I really like how you compared it to how women dream of what their baby will look like or how they'd like it to look. I totally agree with you |
| I understand what you are saying. When I decided to get an OES after decades of being without; I wanted the perfect looking dog. I wanted a full white head, and two brown eyes. I wanted an OES that looked "breed typical" and like what I had growing up.
At the breeder's, there were 2 litters, a total of 17 pups. They were playing with one another, and one pup pulled herself out of the play-pile of dogs, and toddled across the room to climb in my lap. She had 2 black ears and 2 black eye patches; NOT what I was looking for. Little did I know, that SHE had been looking for ME, not the other way around! Tonks turns 2 next month. Of course, after Tonks got in my lap another little pup; the runt of both litters also crawled in next to her. She was wall-eyed; something I never found attractive in animals. Her coat was also very different from her sibling's smooth instead of fluffy. I thought it weird and not at all OES-like. But that's how Luna ended up coming home with us too. And while I like everyone here, and have met a great deal of wonderful and wonderful looking sheepdogs; Tonks and Luna are the most beautiful Sheepdogs I have ever laid eyes on. Neither one is a dog I would have picked from pictures. But both picked ME; and that means so much more to me now!  |
Darth Snuggle wrote: with us too.
Tonks and Luna are the most beautiful Sheepdogs I have ever laid eyes on. Neither one is a dog I would have picked from pictures. But both picked ME; and that means so much more to me now! I LOVE this picture! And what you say is so true. When I got Melody it was the same way. She had this "splash" across her rump. Something I had never seen before & I wasn't sure I could look at everyday & "like it". Of course my husbanad was blind to it & I fugured she'd be more his dog than mine anyways. Once we got her home she decided she was going to be my dog. Not that she didn't spend a ot of time with my husband but for some reason I think she could read my mind about that splash & she was going to prove to me it just didn't matter. Of all my dogs (& I love all of them almost to desperation) I would say I bonded with her to a higher level than my others. She was extremely intelligent & together we achieved our first titles in both conformation & the performance areas. One thing I might add is to let the breeder give you some input on which pups might be a better fit for your lifestyle too. The last thing a breeder wants is a pup returned because "it didn't work out". They want their pups going to forever homes. They have a lot of insight in this area. |
Didn't find exactly what you're looking for? Search again here:
Custom Search
|
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|