Dancer
She is back on just pro plan puppy chicken and rice since no food seemed to help or hinder her progress and she needs the cals and nutrients of puppy food because she's lost weight from having diarreah so long. She eats it up and loves it *shrug* If this doesn't work I have NO idea what the next step should be. |
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| Probiotics? Yogurt?
Worth talking to the vet about. And fingers crossed for you both. |
| Poor girl. I hope this does the trick. |
| fingers crossed that the meds do the trick..x |
Willowsprite wrote: If this doesn't work I have NO idea what the next step should be.
Azathioprine |
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| I hope this works for her. Poor thing. |
| I hope it works for her. |
Best wishes to Dancer. 
How frustrating.  |
| Poor Dancer... |
| Keeping all crossed something works for her. Just might need a longer term on the metro and pred.
Hope she puts on some weight now, keeping you both in our thoughts and everything crossed for Dancer. |
| Speaking with no experience whatsoever, could you give her something like Ensure, just to get calories in her? I'll bet if you froze it, she'd think it was ice cream. If she'd already having diarrhea, maybe it wouldn't hurt just to get weight on her. Or is it not that dire yet? |
| Willowsprite,
I am not up to date on your posting but assume from this one that Dancer is having some GI issues... Had same problems with my 2 year old Bowie. test after test came up negative and the poops just kept getting mushy and mushy. Finally went to a specialist and he recommended Tylan powder. Tylan powder( they sell it on line at feed stores I beleive but due to my guy's stomach problems, I only use the powder I get from my Vet) is very bitter and my dosage is to sprinkle 1/8 teaspoon into his food twice a day. However due its being so bitter tasting, I put it in little capsuls and wrap cheese around for him to swallow. So far it has cleared up our mushy poop and he is dooing very well. The pwoder isn't all that expensive either. I think you are in Canada? Not sure if your vet has it there. Worth a try. Good luck and hope she's better soon, Diane |
ButtersStotch wrote: Speaking with no experience whatsoever, could you give her something like Ensure, just to get calories in her? I'll bet if you froze it, she'd think it was ice cream. If she'd already having diarrhea, maybe it wouldn't hurt just to get weight on her. Or is it not that dire yet?
She is about 35 lbs, for her a normal healthy weight would be 42-45 lbs. She's thin, but not emaciated. Getting her to eat isn't the problem.... she'll eat anything, and enough of it, but her body isn't absorbing the calories from it. Weird thing though, her blood work shows normal levels of potassium, sodium, vitamins, mineral levels etc... so even though she is not gaining and she is still sick, chemistry speaking she is holding her own. Her electrolyte levels are balanced, everything is as it should be except I have a skinny dog with constant diarreah.... I'm not noticing any difference with the combo of meds she is on either... I'm going to try the Purina HA next.... |
| Could she eat things like avocado and salmon? I'm just trying to think of foods that are naturally high in good fat and calories... |
| I assume she has had a thyroid test and is not hyperthyroid? |
kerry wrote: I assume she has had a thyroid test and is not hyperthyroid?
Yes, everything was normal. |
| Another update... still no change... the prednisone even at high doses didn't help... nothing has helped. She's back on puppy food now since she has lost so much weight. She still has constant diarreah and walks like she is hunched in pain so she's just on aspirin now for pain.
She has absolutely no muscle tone left, she's so skinny it's scary, the vets are stumped though. She's eating enough to put weight on, 4 cups of puppy food a day for a 30-35 lb dog who should be at a healthy weight of about 45-47 lbs is actually a lot. If we give her more the diarreah just turns to water and she gets worse. At this level and on this food she at least is not having watery diarreah, just like thin pudding consistency. The only other step we can think of is possibly an MRI to see if she has a gastro form of lymphoma or some other stomach cancer that wasn't detected with x rays, but she would have to be put out and we doubt she'd survive the anesthetic as she is now. We know it's not viral, or bacterial, or fungal, or parasitic, the only thing we haven't been able to absolutely rule out is some forms of cancer because she just isn't strong enough for testing. I'm not sure how long we can/should keep her going like this. I'm so conflicted, she's obviously not comfortable, she hates that she has no control of her bowels, but yet she is still happy to see me and her eyes are bright as always. She is still eating, and though she is in obvious pain sometimes, most of the time she is not and can move around on her own, will run in the yard and dance in the kitchen if she thinks it will get her a treat. I don't know what to do |
| I'm so sorry, it must be very frustrating and sad to see your girl like this. I'm sure celiac has been ruled out, the vets must be pulling their hair with this case.
to you and Dancer |
| There is a disease not usually diagnosed or tested for. its called EPI - short for enzyme pancreatic insufficiency or something like that. the dog is literally starving to death although eating lots of food. Google it and you will see lots of articles. I think they use an endoscopy to diagnosis it.
Maybe worht researching this disease a bit for possible answers/help? Hope things work out. You must be so stressed. |
Ashley wrote: There is a disease not usually diagnosed or tested for. its called EPI - short for enzyme pancreatic insufficiency or something like that. the dog is literally starving to death although eating lots of food. Google it and you will see lots of articles. I think they use an endoscopy to diagnosis it.
Maybe worht researching this disease a bit for possible answers/help? Hope things work out. You must be so stressed. I *think* that is one we tested for early on, but I'm not sure. thanks for the info, I'm looking into it now and going to ask my vet. The symptoms do fit, but if I remember correctly we tested her enzyme levels a couple months ago and everything was at normal levels. |
| ahhhh I am so sorry for her. |
| There are 3 types of tests for EPI:
1. The Serum Trypsin-like Immunoreactivity Test: A blood test is the biggest breakthrough in the diagnosis of Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency so far. 2. The Fecal Protease Test: A stool sample is tested for protein digesting enzymes. 3. The Fecal Elastase Test: The newest test and it is only available for dogs. A single fecal sample is needed although sometimes normal dogs will test negative for Elastase. This means that EPI can be ruled out when the Elastase test is positive but not confirmed when the Elastase test is negative. Marley had all 3 test done when he was ill to rule out EPI.I also got told that all 3 tests might say he hasn't got EPI but he might still have it. I hope you can sort your girl out soon as i know how stressed you will be at the moment ,because i have been through the same thing with Marls,and i know how hard it is to see your girl suffer. I have had Marleys digestive problems sorted now for 4 months and he has put on 2kg in that time. To you and Dancer |
| Stacey so sorry dancer is not getting better, so sad to hear, thinking of you both still and just praying there is some sort of answer for what is happening to her.
Hugs to you both |
| So sorry things arent going well.
Sending good wishes.  |
| Wow, I'm so sorry, your poor girl . I wonder if a digestive enzyme would benefit her? You can buy them OTC in Canada at a health food store and it helps absorb more nutrients leading to weight gain. If you don't have a vet college near you I would suggest you call Michigan State, they have an awesome staff and I'm sure they can help in some way. I called them when Beau was diagnosed with synovi sarcoma and they found a vet oncologist who specializes in canine radiation for us, they didn't charge anything. Maybe they know of someone near you who can help, this seems to be beyond the scope of a regular vet. |
Quote: If you don't have a vet college near you I would suggest you call Michigan State, they have an awesome staff and I'm sure they can help in some way. I agree, Holly. MSU doctors and students were great. Wondering if your vet might be able to call for a consultation if you don't have a teaching hospital nearby. You might ask the vet if you can try Enbosorb. You also need to ask about the length of time it can safely be used. It only controls the symptoms, not the cause, of diarrhea. I was just wondering if it might make Dancer a little more comfortable... http://www.prnpharmacal.com/endosorb/canine.php Quote: Endosorb products are formulated with an improved attapulgite that adsorbs toxins and toxic materials present in the gut of animals with symptoms of diarrhea. The adsorbent action helps to relieve the irritation discomfort and cramping associated with diarrhea. If the diarrhea is caused by, or associated with a bacterial intestinal infection, then appropriate antibiotic therapy should be started as soon as possible.
Animals being treated with Endosorb should have access to fresh clear drinking water in liberal portions. Veterinarian practitioners report that most of the diarrhea cases they see are effectively treated with Endosorb. Endosorb provides a safe, low-cost treatment option for your practice and clients. Endosorb is distributed only through ethical veterinary suppliers for dispensing by licensed veterinarians. We're all pulling for your sweet girl. |
| How frustrating for you. I hope you can find the answer to help sweet Dancer.
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| Wow, I am only reading this thread now. I am so sorry for what you are going through. I guess you really do understand the frustration with Lola. Your poor baby and poor you. I'll say a prayer for Dancer.
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| hugs for you and Dancer |
| So sorry --special thoughts and prayers for Dancer and your family. |
| Stacey -
Any progress with Dancer? I'm sorry to read that she's having such a rough time. I hope you've been able to get her some relief. It is such a difficult and frightening situation. |
| Nothing different.... I bathed her yesterday but being clean didn't last long because of the diarreah.
Apparently all her levels when we last ran tests were normal for lipase and amalayse too, which would be off if she had EPI. It also rules out celiac. She seems to be moving around a bit better with just baby aspirin. As long as she is comfortable and happy I can deal with the rest... I've been giving her snacks again since it doesn't seem to matter what she is fed, including her favorite, cheese, and leftover pasta etc and I do think she's maybe gained a bit of weight. We've come to the conclusion for now that she is just an old dog before her time.... some things you just can't fix, you can only try to make them a bit better. |
| So sorry about dancer. was sort of hoping it was the EPI as that is controllable. Not knowing what the problem is makes it worse. Hope she feels better.
I guess the blood work would show Chron's disease also? Maybe some digestive enzymes' would help anyway? Just reaching for straws... Our prayers are with dancer and you. I know how upsetting it is when our babies are sick. Did anyone mention Tylan powder yet? It helped our guy get the diarrea under control. Sending good thoughts... Diane |
Willowsprite wrote: Apparently all her levels when we last ran tests were normal for lipase and amalayse too, which would be off if she had EPI. It also rules out celiac.
That's not the way to diagnose EPI (or celiac disease) ... Levels of lipase and amylase are only diagnostic if they are elevated, if they are normal/low they can't be used to diagnose anything ... |
SeaLords wrote: Willowsprite wrote: Apparently all her levels when we last ran tests were normal for lipase and amalayse too, which would be off if she had EPI. It also rules out celiac. That's not the way to diagnose EPI (or celiac disease) ... Levels of lipase and amylase are only diagnostic if they are elevated, if they are normal/low they can't be used to diagnose anything ... Thats my understanding too . I have friends with EPI dogs and they had to have specific tests . |
| I was under the understanding they would be low if it was epi? Since everything was normal I didn't think going ahead with further testing made sense.
We have tried digestive enzymes and they didn't help, but they weren't the ones specific to epi. |
| All Marleys test were normal too but i was told off the vet and EPI friends
to test for EPI. Which i did and he was negative. I think the digestive enzymes substitute is prancease (not to sure) or pigs pancreas. |
Willowsprite wrote: I was under the understanding they would be low if it was epi? Since everything was normal I didn't think going ahead with further testing made sense.
We have tried digestive enzymes and they didn't help, but they weren't the ones specific to epi. No, enzyme levels in the blood can't be used for diagnosing EPI. Read the post of sixpence in the previous page, it's TLI that is "the" test for EPI. Got curious, what digestive enzymes did you use? |
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