Not having a good day
We took Madison and Bailey to get spayed and neutured today and to have bloodwork done to check everything else also. They are seven months old and are brother and sister. The first call we got was that Maddie's kidneys were not functioning properly. We authorized the extra tests and it came back okay, just a urinary tract infection that must have just started. So, now back to the surgery. We had noticed Bailey's clicking hip before and waited until this scheduled surgery to get X rays, it was only a week. Well, he has total hip dysplacia. The vet said she did not even know why he was walking around. Madison's hips are a little better, but not good. They have always had large breed puppy food and smaller amounts than the bag recommended. The vet always said give them what they want for twenty minutes and then take it away. So, we did. We always went on short walks with a longer one evry once in a while. I am sure it is nothing we did wrong, it just happened. I am so mad,sad, whatever right now. We looked for a breeder and I would not say we were in a hurry, but we did hurry, I guess. I wish I had known about this site then. We found a breeder in Towson, MD. She had both parents on the premises and this was her second litter she was selling. The mother was not two years old yet and from what I had read, they could not see hip dysplasia until then. She seemed to love her dogs alot and they had a good home. Yes, she is a backyard breeder, but all seemed okay. I just went to her website recently and saw she had already bred the mother again and now she has nine puppies for sale. That is three litters of puppies that I know of in eighteen months. Does not sound right to me. She is supposed to have a two year health guarantee, which I didn't ask much about either. I am just so mad right now, mainly at myself. We love our babies. They are the kindest, sweetest dogs I know. We have to go see an orthopedic surgeon after they heal from the fixing, so I guess we will know better what to do then. I know a frien who had an English Mastiff's hips fixed about fifteen years ago and it was over four thousand dollars. I will do what I have to to keep our babies happy, but geez! Has anyone had surgery for HD? I am sure there are different levels of it, but I just needed some preliminary thoughts. Will their quality of life be good after surgery? Anyone buying puppies out of MD should pm me for info as I am sure this next litter is subject to the same thing. I am going to talk to the breeder and see what she says. Even if we got some money back or whatever happens when you need to exercise the health guarantee, she is still overbreeding her dog and it just makes me sick. Any opinions will be welcome. I am just mad now and not really thinking so I am sure I left some details out. Thanks for letting me vent. Eric |
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| Hi Eric!
As for your Hip Dysplasia question- I know that Josh's Pooh has H.D., and I don't think he's getting surgery for it yet- you might want to compare notes with him. My parent's male cavalier spaniel also has sever H.D., but it has yet to affect his every day activities- you'd never know it! So there's hope for your pup living a normal life! I do know of one of our members (pardon me, I don't remember who off the top of my head) did have hip surgery done on her dog- who was older, with good results. (I'm hoping they'll chime in) I'm so sorry to hear about your dogs' health issues, it's bad enough when one is ill, but horrid when both of them have problems! It does sound like your breeder was not as responsible as one might wish. I hope you have success with reparations. Karen  |
| Hi, Eric. It was our Drez that had surgery for hip dysplasia (from Karen's note above).
First off, let me say how sorry I am for you right now, and how my heart goes out to you and your family. From this site I've learned so much, one of which is that if the mother of a litter is under two years old, run in the opposite direction. You're right - hip dysplasia can't be detected until two years old. The so-called breeder where you got your dogs from should be shut down. Anyone can love their dogs, but to breed them so wantonly, without regard to the mother's health or to what maladies she is passing on to the puppies is nothing short of despicable and greedy. As for surgery, here's what we did. Drez was 11 yrs old last August. In October the vet said that she had HD in both hips, that the right side was worse, and that if we did nothing except give her meds for the pain, she would be totally lame within a year. After much soul searching, fact finding, and opinion getting from the wonderful people on this forum, we opted to have her right hip operated on, a procedure called femoral head ostectomy (FHO). Don't know how much you know about the condition, but in a nutshell, HD is when the rounded hip joint that the ball joint fits into is flatter than round, so it cannot properly hold that ball joint in place and the result is that the ball joint moves around in the hip. One bone just rubs against the other. The rubbing ultimately causes arthritis to set in, making the dog lame. The site below is a great article on the condition and the operation choices, complete with pictures. www.lbah.com/Canine/hip_dysplasia.htm Not wanting to watch Drez become increasingly lame to the point where we'd have to put her down, we opted for the surgery, even at her advanced age. We had no emotional choice - she's our baby girl. She was home the same night. The first few days were rough, because she couldn't stand on her own. We had to sling two old sheets under her belly, one behind her front legs and one in front of her rear legs, to help her walk outside to do her business. By the third day, she was getting up on her own, still wobbly, but getting up. Took her awhile, though, to do stairs. Still goes up them very slowly, but she gives it her all. It's still a little tough for her to get up on the hardwood floors sometimes, and she's learned to give us that "well, are you gonna help me?" look to guilt us into boosting her rear end up. We will not have her left hip done. The right hip will never be strong enough to support the left hip while it's convalescing, and her age is against her, too. The FHO cost us a tad over $800. If we had gone with total hip replacement, we would have had to go to an orthopedic vet surgeon (instead of a regular vet) at a cost of about $4000. Although you don't like to think that cost should be a factor when taking care of our dogs, sometimes it just is. That, plus her age, again. A hip replacement is much more major surgery than an FHO, and I wasn't sure she could get through the recuperation. I've been too long-winded here already, and I apologize. This subject just gets me so worked up. If you want to read what I posted before Drez's surgery, check out: http://forum.oes.org/viewtopic.php?t=1669 Please check out that article for more info. If you want to talk about it more, you can always e-mail me privately. Good luck, and I'll keep you in my prayers. Chris |
| Chris,
Thanks! We are going to talk t everyone we need to to decide what to do. I am going to get the babies fixed, even if it means delaying the finishing of my racecar even more. They are our babies and so young that as long as we can give them a quality , pain free life, we will. I sort of knew we were not doing the right thing getting the puppies the way we did. I had just lost my 14 year old poodle to cancer and my wife had had a sheepie before, so we decided on that. I wish I had taken more time, but I was also thinking that these puppies are already on this earth, so they will never have to be rescued if we get them. I know that may sound weird, but everyone tells me I am a little weird.
I am disappointed in the breeder. Her female had puppies Jan 2004, July 2004 and Jan 2005. She explained that the second litter was an accident, but I have a hard time believing that now. Thanks for your support. I will keep you posted with what is going on. Maybe it won't be as bad as I first thought. Have a nice day, Eric |
SheepdogMarine wrote: They have always had large breed puppy food and smaller amounts than the bag recommended. The vet always said give them what they want for twenty minutes and then take it away. So, we did. We always went on short walks with a longer one evry once in a while. I am sure it is nothing we did wrong, it just happened.
Eric This is not because you did anything wrong! This is a genetic problem - there's nothing you could have done to prevent it. I would be mad as well - you have a right to be. Hopefully others will learn from your lesson!!! My best to Madison & Bailey! Many dogs live full lives with HD without requiring surgery. Good Luck Kristen |
| Hi,
I'm so sorry you and your family have to go through this, I can't begin to express how sad I am apon hearing this news. Last night I spoke to a friend of mine whom works with dogs and mentioned your story. We were lamenting that even if a breeder quarantees the puppy's health, unless they offer to pay the full cost it doesn't help you guys much. Another puppy? Nope wouldn't work as Madison and Bailey are part of your family, you have bonded with them and love them. Returning them for a refund..doesn't work either, unless it's a inanimate object but not a living breathing creature. That's why stories such as these are so heartbreaking. Please keep us updated as to what options you have found and I'll keep you all in my thoughts. You know in some awful karma that these two are lucky they have found their way into your home. There's no doubt you love them and will try everything humanely possible to make them better. Hugs from me Marianne and the boys |
| Thanks for all of the replies and support! This really is a great place!
We have an appointment with an orthopedic surgeon on March 14. That gives them enough time to heal from their spaying/neuturing. There are several options. It looks like there is a really good chance we can get them fixed, Bailey has the worst hip. Maddie's only look mild after looking at the website Drezzie's Mom listed above. The FHO is approx 1200.00 per hip. The TPO is approx 2200.00 per hip. Total hip replacement is 3900.00 per hip! 
I guess I should have been a vet.
This is all a big learning experience, hopefully it will help someone else. I have not even talked to the breeder yet to see what exactly happens with the two year health guarantee. She is aware of the problem. She WILL NOT get the dogs back! They are our babies now. I guess the best I could hope for would be the $800 each I paid for them. We will see. Another lesson for prospective dog owners. It is a shame the AKC does not recognize puppy litters being registered from the same mother so quickly and do something about it. Maybe the AKC registration doesn't really mean much. I think a breeder's reputation would be the most important thing to consider if I had it to do over. At least the kids are doing well from their surgery. Keeping them calm just takes a lot of supervision. I will keep you posted. At least I am a lot more optimistic now! Eric |
SheepdogMarine wrote: I have not even talked to the breeder yet to see what exactly happens with the two year health guarantee. She is aware of the problem. She WILL NOT get the dogs back! They are our babies now. I guess the best I could hope for would be the $800 each I paid for them. We will see. Another lesson for prospective dog owners. Unfortunately, most health guarantees offers a "replacement" dog - which I don't think many of us could give our babies back even after one day!  I think some of the breeders count on this!Quote: It is a shame the AKC does not recognize puppy litters being registered from the same mother so quickly and do something about it. Maybe the AKC registration doesn't really mean much. I think a breeder's reputation would be the most important thing to consider if I had it to do over.
I was disappointed that the AKC doesn't get more involved in controlling this too - but they are just a registery - which is unfortunate. I guess this is where the Breed Clubs come into play. We all live and learn - and I'm sure you will help others by sharing your experience. Hang in there! The treatment is expensive - but it is well worth it! Kristen |
| My 2 cents: Pooh has HD, diagnosed at 5 1/2 months. Our vet told us that we should watch the weight, give glucosamine supplements and see how he does over time. There is no sign of any lameness or pain, so we're going to wait and see! There may not be anything for years, or it could be tomorrow. I just do not want to commit Pooh to more surgery especially if he won't need it.
Finding out about the HD was rough on me, even more so than the intestinal blockage he had in December. I feel better about it knowing there was nothing I could have done to prevent it. Took him on a nice long run tonight, I think he enjoyed it. He's asleep at my feet as I type, so I feel bad having to wake him up now for the last tinkle of the night before bed. At the end of the day, we all do whatever we can for our "babies". If they are in pain, we want to make that go away. If there is no sign of pain, perhaps you wait......again, just my 2 cents. |
| Eric I'm so sorry to hear you are going through this. I have no advice to offer since I have never experienced it myself, but I do know of many dogs with HD that live normal happy lives,without surgery, and sometimes need arthritis meds a little earlier in life than if their hips had been perfect.
I'm sure you'll make whatever decision is best for you and your dogs, please let us know how things go and what you decide |
| Eric-
I was so sorry to hear of your problems, we feel so helpless sometimes. You may want to contact the vet school at Michigan State. Perhaps they can give you further info, they are very up-to-date on things. Best of luck!  |
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