breeder
http://www.oldenglishsheepdogs.ca.tt/ They have put ads out on Kijiji for the puppy Chloe. I wasn't able to find any of their dogs listed at the OFA for certification of hips and so on... Thank you. Lookin for a OES puppy or former show dog |
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| Well, let's start out with the fact that their website has some dirty rotten deceptive pop-up advertising, and you can extrapolate from there.
I've disabled the link to their site. |
| There are a few things on their web site that I find suspicious, and I just got through one page. Firstly, breeders are not members of the AKC or (as far as I know) CKC, their dogs may be registered through those organizations but they are not "members".
They don't say anywhere that they breed for the 'betterment of the breed'. They do state that "Our primary concern is to provide you and your family with a healthy puppy that has a wonderful disposition and good confirmation." Confirmation of what? They probably mean "conformation", which is striving to attain the ideal according to breed standard. That's a pretty serious typo to have on web site or they really don't know what they're talking about. "When we chose our own dogs, we looked carefully for lines that contained an excellent to good OFA record." Does this mean they don't do testing on the dogs they breed themselves? How many generations back were the lines tested? Parents of each litter should have OFA ratings on hips at the very minimum. The best place to start looking for a breeder is through the Old English Sheepdog Club of America (OESCA) Breeder Referral Service http://www.oldenglishsheepdogclubofamer ... ectory.htm , or if you're in Canada, The Old English Sheepdog & Owner's Club of Canada www.oesocc.com/ Good luck in finding a reputable breeder. Please join the forum and ask lots of questions. Most of us have been through a similar search and are happy to assist in any way. |
| Both very good responses. One thing to remember is the hip rating that Nita mentioned. We'd all love to have an OFA Excellent bred to an OFA Excellent. But in the real world that doesn't guarantee anything....it just gives you better odds at producing a litter with decent hip ratings. I've had more than one vet trained in OFA tell me "don't throw the baby out with the bath water". In another words, look at the hip ratings several generations back on each side. Breeding to a Fair is not a bad thing, especially if you are seeing a lot of goods & excellents in their background & the background of your bitch. Remember, the OFA ratings come about by trained radiologists (3) opinions that particular day. There can be a lot factors that come into play when they do the ratings. |
| I totally agree, well said
ChSheepdogs wrote: Both very good responses. One thing to remember is the hip rating that Nita mentioned. We'd all love to have an OFA Excellent bred to an OFA Excellent. But in the real world that doesn't guarantee anything....it just gives you better odds at producing a litter with decent hip ratings. I've had more than one vet trained in OFA tell me "don't throw the baby out with the bath water". In another words, look at the hip ratings several generations back on each side. Breeding to a Fair is not a bad thing, especially if you are seeing a lot of goods & excellents in their background & the background of your bitch. Remember, the OFA ratings come about by trained radiologists (3) opinions that particular day. There can be a lot factors that come into play when they do the ratings. |
| Hi everyone,
I just wanted to write on OFA certs. The difference between excellent, good and fair is very minimal and the x-ray clearity is many times the cause. I won't put my dogs under for the x-rays as many others won't as well. It's not worth the risk to me. This can affect the clearity. The fact that they are certified states that the hips are good for breeding. If they were not they wouldn't get a cert. period. Zach |
| This is interesting reading about dogs rated OFA "fair" too...
http://offa.org/hipguide.html It's just one more reason why it's important to find a breeder who knows what they're doing and not simply leaving everything to chance. |
| Thanks, that was an informative link. |
| Hi again,
I wanted to add that in no way am I saying a dog with an ofa should be bred. I was just saying that for me, once the ofa is clear regardless of the rating, then the real work on research begins. There's so much more to review and consider before making a decision to breed a pair. With that said, even with the deepest research and best possible mating pair, anything can occur because of the history of most of the foundation stock for OES in the US. Most of the conscientious breeders here in the states that I know, work hard to gain every piece of info they can before making a decision on a mating pair. Then, they have their fingers crossed on every litter hoping their research, knowledge and experience pays off with a healthy litter. Zach |
zach wrote: Hi again,
I wanted to add that in no way am I saying a dog with an ofa should be bred. I was just saying that for me, once the ofa is clear regardless of the rating, then the real work on research begins. There's so much more to review and consider before making a decision to breed a pair. With that said, even with the deepest research and best possible mating pair, anything can occur because of the history of most of the foundation stock for OES in the US. Most of the conscientious breeders here in the states that I know, work hard to gain every piece of info they can before making a decision on a mating pair. Then, they have their fingers crossed on every litter hoping their research, knowledge and experience pays off with a healthy litter. Zach Very well put, Zach. . |
| This is a breeder here in Ontario. I do know that she does not show her dogs. The dogs on her site that I have seen in my opinion do not conform to the breed standard. She claims to have hip certs done, but when I had inquired with her and wanted to see them, she could not produce them. I have also never heard of any of the kennel names in her dogs pedigrees.
Just be aware and ask lots of questions! |
| Thank you all for your posts. I think I will run from this breeder and her ad for the little puppy that she had purchased for her breeding program that she now wants to get rid of.
I have leads on good breeders in my area and will wait ... Do breeders re-home their retired show dogs often? |
Anonymous wrote: Do breeders re-home their retired show dogs often?
Yes, you will find reputable breeders out there that will rehome retired show dogs. Sometimes we have one that we can tell would prefer to be an "only & spoiled" dog. Or perhaps they would prefer to be part of "smaller pack" where they would get more individual attention. Our dogs get alot of attention & I myself have never rehomed one of my retired show dogs as I usually go on to work with them in performance. But Cathy & I have had retired show dogs that have lived with her that have gone on to live with other owners simply because she & I could tell the dog would be happier. There is nothing wrong with asking that question of a breeder when you contact them. Far too often people think it is only proper to ask for "puppies". |
I always tell people that if they have any doubts about a breeder, absolutely don't go to see their puppies. OES pups will melt your heart and few potential buyers can walk away from one. If their living conditions are good, they believe they are buying a good pup. If the conditions are bad, they convince themselves that they are rescuing the pup. It sounds like you are on the right track for finding a good breeder. 
Breeders do occasionally place retired show dogs with families. Sometimes breeders will have companion dogs returned for various reasons, usually not the fault of the dog. Our rescue has worked with quality breeders to help find homes for such dogs but the agreement is always between the breeder and the new family. Nita Midwest OES Rescue |
Anonymous wrote: Thank you all for your posts. I think I will run from this breeder and her ad for the little puppy that she had purchased for her breeding program that she now wants to get rid of.
I have leads on good breeders in my area and will wait ... Do breeders re-home their retired show dogs often? I don't know about often, but it definitely happens. Suggest you let whomever you talk to know that you might be interested. It can't hurt. I got my oldest girl that way, as well as my most recent addition. Granted, I did some begging to make it happen  But it was worth it.
Kristine |
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