Diabetic, on drugs or drunk? Does it really matter?
<script src="http://i.cdn.turner.com/cnn/.element/js/2.0/video/evp/module.js?loc=dom&vid=/video/us/2008/12/09/dnt.kwtv.diabetic.tased.kwtv" type="text/javascript"></script><noscript>Embedded video from <a href="http://www.cnn.com/video">CNN Video</a></noscript> Does it matter that the driver was diabetic or drunk or drugged? He may have been "resisting" but was he being dangerous to the point of needing to use a Taser? I think not. I think this was clearly an abusive use of force that shouldn't have been used on a person behaving in that manner whether diabetic, drunk or high. |
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| Tell that to all the widows and orphaned children who lost their police husband/father this year...until it's all said and done they never know what they're facing and unfortunately too many have died...just this year a 25 yr. old policeman with a premature baby in intensive care was killed for a routine traffic stop...the baby died two months later...just think last Christmas a young couple were expecting a baby excited about their future, this year a 25 year old woman is missing her husband and baby. I don't know the answer but in the officers defense...they never know until AFTER the fact what they are dealing with when called for help. |
| Sorry guest. my dad was a NYC police officer for 27 years - the last half dozen or so in Bedford Stuyvesant during the late 70's and early 80's. You know the job going in and abusing maybe perhaps violent or not citizens is not part of the drill. |
| Don't get me wrong, guest... if the suspect (even this one) was posing any kind of a threat other than being "frozen".... then I think the cop has the right to do what he truly believes is necessary to protect him or her self.
However... I am married to a diabetic. I am very familiar with their behavior when their sugar is low. This guy was not "combative" he was basically immobilized. A blood glucose of 11 is basically comatose. I have no idea how this guy was walking at all evfter being tased, perhaps the tasing got his liver to release some sugar, or more likely he was 11 after being tased and then transported to the hospital but was likely in the 20's or 30's when they confronted him. If they didn't have a taser, would they just have beat him on the head with a nightstick? Shot him? The Taser makes using this extremely brutal level of non-lethal force seem acceptable. For Pete's sake, I bet you wouldn't approve of tasering a dog who wasn't growling? The whole level of violence perpetrated by police on the citizenry has increased dramatically over the last couple of decades. Roughly throwing all suspects to the ground and standing on their necks is commonplace for the most routine of situations. This only makes things worse in the neighborhoods where they are trying to quell violence. Plus of course they lied; they said they only saw his necklace at the hospital. Then why did they suddenly ask him "Are you on drugs or are you just diabetic" in the crusier before they called the ambulnce? Because when they were patting him down they found the necklace, which is standard operating procedure. These guys KNEW what they did was wrong and were already covering their backsides. Lemme on the jury... |
| like you Ron my Hubby is a diabetic. I am going to ask my son who is a NYS Trooper what he knows. So glad you posted this. Maybe a diabetic should have another way to diplay this. On their Plates or a sticker in the windsheild. |
OES Mommy wrote: like you Ron my Hubby is a diabetic. I am going to ask my son who is a NYS Trooper what he knows. So glad you posted this. Maybe a diabetic should have another way to diplay this. On their Plates or a sticker in the windsheild.
My husband is diabetic too and I have to say I am not sure if that should matter. I understand from a collegue who grew up with a diabetic mother that people can get violent when they are in misallignment. but Police are trained to correctly subdue violent citizens. what happened to Peace Officers in charge of protecting people - sometimes from themselves? |
| As a CEN/ Trauma nurse that is also an ACLS ( Advanced Cardiac Life Support ) Instructor, I will go on record as saying Tasers are dangerous. Our hearts are controlled by electrical impulses. If that heart receives a jolt of electricity at a certain point in its rhythm it can send it into lethal rhythms...V-tach/V-fib.
My DH is in law enforcement and his getting home the most important part of my life. If he needs it to get home then God Bless. But it is not a " less lethal method of control', and should never be considered as such. It should not be used indiscriminately on diabetic's, the unruelly,etc. If the charge is deployed during the defendents R on T cycle (electrical cycle of the heart ) they can and most likely go into one of these deadly rhythms. |
| Clearly this guy was not aggressive so the use of force was not warranted but this is a pretty poor case to use to ask this question. If someone is aggressive, it does not matter if they are drunk or on drugs or diabetic, they are aggressive first or foremost.
As a person on the other end of this question, a caregiver, the first person that you are responsible for is yourself. If someone is aggressive, no matter the cause for it, they need to be subdued to both protect the person trying to help and to make it possible for you to treat them. So, we can't just say that people get treated differently because their behavior is caused by a medical condition. If your blood sugar is out of whack and I have to hold you down in order to treat you, don't cry about the bruises afterword. (Most people with blood sugar issues understand this as well!) A lot of times, it is not possible to tell if behavior is caused by diabetes or drugs or if it's their natural state until you get up close and personal with them. And if you take a swing at someone, you get to be subdued until your attitude changes no matter what the cause. I do believe that proper use of force is essential but remember not to lump all situations into one basket when considering these issues.  |
| My point was the same as yours... that the behavior is the issue not the cause. The police Chief Ken Brown seemed upset that the citizen was tased, but only because he was diabetic and not on drugs. He should be upset about the use of excessive force on a non-combative suspect.
I think the Chief Ken Brown could use some retraining. |
| I have diabetes and i know a girl who also had it. In high school she had a low blood sugar and no one helped her and when the teacher finally did they started lecturing her about not doing drugs! It's the most horrible feeling in the world! You can't move and it feels like there is a 50 pound weight on your chest making it hard to breathe.
I have long hair and it further interferes with my breathing when I'm low cause you sweat like a pig as your body is in high drive trying to release all the sugar from your fat cells which increases your body temperature like crazy! sugar that isn't really there either. You don't really understand what is going on around you and it's one of the scariest things in the world that few people can understand. I've lived alone for the past 2 years and had to crawl across my floor and open a door while i was so low i couldn't even speak properly (my blood sugar was less than 1 and i should have been unconscious). Now imagine that the person that should be helping you starts beating the crap out of you?? I couldn't even imagine how scary that would be. I would probably just stop trying and pass out and die myself- he'd have broken my spirit pretty quickly. Letting policemen/women act like that without consequences for the situation makes them feel like their higher than the general public and that should not be the case. We have police to protect us from ourselves but their humans too. That beings said that also means their not perfect so maybe full punishment shouldn't be given-but punishment is still needed. But i know for the longest time if a diabetic took a Breathalyzer would show that we were drunk. They changed things since then, but there are A LOT of diabetics out there and they should know what a distressed diabetic looks like and if they don't then it's not the policeman's fault here but the people training him and they should be the ones taking punishment. It comes down to the fact that the policeman here has the power and with that comes a certain about of responsibility for his actions and duties to the public. If he assessed the situation and though force was required that's fine, but he still has consequences for his actions. It's part of his job. |
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