"Should I breed?" flow chart
It's a little small in the post but more legible full size. You can click on the chart to get the full size version. |
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| What a great chart Jill. Hopefully it will be a usefull tool for people considering breeding. |
| I wish we could add a second third, etc page to that explaining in depth to why if you answered no to any of those ...why you shouldn't continue. It seems pretty obvious to me but that's because I've participated in 100 debates on HERE about breeding, so I don't need further clarification. I plan on saving that picture to send to idiots I know, but again... would be nice if it continued on because a simple "no" doesn't grab the heart. Assuming many are people w/good intentions but just need a sound explanation to why this eliminates their dog for breeding. |
| Excellent. I think we should make it a sticky. |
| Very nice!! |
| A sticky would be nice. |
Jill, Fantastic  |
| Great chart Jill. |
| This chart seems to suggest that the only dogs that deserve to exist are the ones that are going to be shown in competition. Again, while some of the info maybe useful or educational, it is not at all useful or realistic, it's just more of showbreeders propaganda. |
Cadenza wrote: This chart seems to suggest that the only dogs that deserve to exist are the ones that are going to be shown in competition. Again, while some of the info maybe useful or educational, it is not at all useful or realistic, it's just more of showbreeders propaganda.
No, it's to make sure that dogs that are being bred continue to be the breeds that they started out as. The more people you have breeding without taking these things into consideration, the further and further away you get from what an OES is supposed to be. The standards aren't in place for nothing. If you don't care about standards or bettering the breed, there's plenty of dogs at the shelter or in rescue for you. |
| Showing has a purpose other than ego. It's meant to compare every entry against the breed standard. Breeders with good champion bloodlines spend years and huge amounts of money to help ensure their breed continues to stay strong and represents the reason the breed exists. |
Excellant Chart and explains things in simple terms as to why you should or should not breed.  |
| Hi....
an interesting Chart...easy to understand...also for Germans.. 
Regards Michael |
| this chart is COLD BLOODED. pure Propaganda |
| No, it is not propaganda. It is to preserve the quality of the dog breed. Indescriminate breeding without history allows contamination to occur........maybe an off breed in the previous past......say a poodle grandparent.....similar but not pure. It also allows more poor quality dogs to enter the gene pool creating problems for the breed as a whole. Who ever heard of vicious cocker spaniels or St. Bernards until the breeds became fashion and were being bred for a quick buck. Suddenly what were once gentle breeds became known for being vicious. Bad hips became all to common in the giant dog. I especially like the line about if you are doing it right, you will not make money! |
Quote: this chart is COLD BLOODED. pure Propaganda No Kaya. Not. At. All. Several excellent and reputable breeders have commented in this thread - all positively. We only want to preserve and improve the breed we love. Everyone thinks they have a lovely dog but only a very very few are fit to breed. And I too love the part -- if you're doing it right you're not making money. Shellie |
| I agree that this is a very informative and enlightening chart. While I have never and do not entertain an interest in breeding, I do have an interest in the quality of an animal's health and life. My favorite part of the chart is "breeding carries huge responsibilities". To me, that seems the crux of the matter in one simple statement. Those huge responsibilities can become a burden of such for the breed, their owners, and most importantly, the dog. Jill, thank you for this thread. |
Kaya wrote: this chart is COLD BLOODED. pure Propaganda Propaganda? For whom? What its doing is asking people with dogs that should not be bred, not to breed. And it helps to identify those dogs. What happens when a dog that should not be bred is bred anyway, is that you have a litter of puppies that for one reason or another may not be suitable for people to adopt. Let pretend I'm a big dummy, and I see that there is an OES litter being advertised one town over from me. I go look, and the puppies are VERY cute. The parent dogs aren't show dogs, but they do have AKC paperwork. The people seem really nice, and their puppies look healthy to me. I ask about health certificates; they don't have them. I ask if any of the dogs have been shown, they tell me that shows are just for people with egos. I still think those are some really cute puppies and I buy 2. I spend the next 12 months with my puppies at the vet every other week. The breeder never answered my emails or calls after my check cleared. My dogs have temperment issues, requiring thousands of dollars of training. Oh wait; this isn't a game of "Lets Pretend". I AM a big dummy, and this is the story of Tonks and Luna. And our "breeder"? Lots of her puppies end up in our local OES rescue; I get to have lots of family re-unions for Tonks and Luna and their siblings. This breeder isn't breeding to any standard; she has some dogs, and puts out as many litters as she can a year, so she can make some money. And she just acquired herself a new, 9 month old breeding bitch. What you call COLD BLOODED I call responsible breeding. Anyone else that adopted my dogs would have had one or both put to sleep at 5 months old. In fact, that was one of the options my vet gave me. So what's more cold blooded; breeding dogs to standards that will enable them to live happy, well adjusted and healthy lives? Or breeding dogs that people can't handle, dump on rescues and at pounds, or worse, have put to sleep for health or temperment issues they can't deal with. |
| I think some people may be offended by the chart because they may have obtained their dogs by means that we wouldn't responsibly recommend. The point of this is not to shame anyone into feeling bad about the choice that they made, only to learn from it and make better educated decisions for the next time. I would say that the majority of us here did NOT start with dogs from responsible breeders (I know I didn't) but hopefully this chart will help you understand that although you have a fabulous family pet, they're likely not fantastic breeding stock. Enjoy and love your dog as you should but recognize that responsible breeding is much more than picking two "purebred" dogs. |
SheepieBoss wrote: I especially like the line about if you are doing it right, you will not make money! I can vouch for that! |
| That's a great chart! Just big guidelines, but it maybe helps someone to understand that every dog is not meant to have puppies. |
| Good idea with the chart but its just for the US I think. As for spending money on training medical bills for OESD I think that is just part of owning a dog. Dogs are like humans each are diff. Some kind & some are not also same with the health issues. You will get the odd dog which is not verry good but I would say abou 90% are. The problem is the owners & most of the time not the dog. Like most kids ( Puppies ) if you bring them up ok they will be fine & some learn faster than others. As for breeding. You might have go go around the world to find another dog to breed with your bitch as the line gets watred down & thats when you get the problems also the odd funny deform might arrise from the line from years ago which most people have nissed over the years. I will stop going on. What do I know as I am new to the breed but I think its like most dog breeds |
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