Question about possible seperation anxiety????
She is a wonderful baby, and she fits in great with our family! I love her so much, cant even imagine life without her now! She does have one problem that I could use some advice with. When we first got her, she was crate trained, and that was great! I dont work, but of course every once in awhile my hubby and I like to go out to dinner or what not, so we put her in the kennel! Of course not for very long. After the first few times (she was great then...) she began to soil her crate, and then spread it everywhere!!!! Well I talked with Ingrid, and she suggested that she was just angry that we were leaving her ( she is house trained besides that) and that I should keep putting her in there with me at home, to get her used to the idea that I am not leaving forever! That worked out pretty good, and I did it all last week, and by the end of it, we were able to leave her for a bit in the crate and she didnt soil it or herself. The problem is that now, instead of soiling the crate, I think that she is panting and barking the whole time we are gone, because her face is all wet when we get home. Then when we take her out after getting home, she has diarrhea outside (but at no other time, so I know that she isnt sick!). I was hoping that this would work itself out, then tonight, after going out to dinner, we came home to an interesting situation. She had sprayed the wall in the dining room with a small amount of diarrhea, but there was none on her, or the bottom of the crate for that matter. We took her out, and she did her business. Her face was also all wet, from barking or panting. I am assuming that this is seperation anxiety of some sort, and I think that she is getting so worked up that we might never come back, that she is making herself sick! As much as I would love to be with her at all times, as you all know that is impossible. Is there anything I can do to help her cope with us being gone?????? Of course I will never ever get rid of her! It just breaks my heart that she is so upset, and cant take us leaving! Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks in advance! Amber |
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| Aw, I know how hard that can be. Our OES was also like that when he was a puppy. What we did was put him in his crate and leave the house in increasingly longer increments. First, we'd leave for like 5 minutes, come back in, let him out, praise like crazy and then repeat that a few times during the day. We gradually increased to about 20 minutes, then an hour, 2 hours, etc. It took awhile but he never seemed to get anxious again because he knew we always came back.
Good luck! |
| Yes, what you're experiencing is seperation anxiety. Poor girl. She's nervous and scared while you're gone and working herself into a frenzy or being sick.
Jill gave you good advice. Start slowly and increase the time you're gone in small increments. Always praise her and treat her when you come in to let her out of the crate. Hopefully, soon, she'll realize that you always come back for her. Also, you'll want to give her a treat going into the crate and something to occupy her while she's in there. I use kongs. My two run into their crates and turn around for me to hand it to them. They know crates = kongs and they volunteer to go in without a problem. 
Good luck to you and congrats on adopting Agatha. 
Now...about those pictures!! |
| Thanks to both of you! Great advice! I will be home today and tomorrow cleaning the house, so I will work on that! I will also get a Kong for her, because that should keep her occupied, she loves to eat!
I also read online about the DAP, and I am pondering that idea as well! Thanks again! I will get those pictures up and running, I promise!!!!! Amber |
| i am having the same problem with duffy today i went out and put him in the crate and i know all he did was bark the entire time he was wet also. i have been home too much and he though he dodn't need the crate i guess |
| Sorry to hear about Duffy! THat was what I was thinking too, because her face was all wet. This afternoon I am going to go to petsmart to get the DAP and a Kong toy so I can put food in it, and I will see how it goes....
By the way, I see that you are in Cocoa , Fl. I grew up in Merritt Island! My parents still live there and we go often!!!! I do miss the area, although Tennessee is very nice!!!! Hang in there with Duffy and I will do the same with Agatha! Amber |
| if toy come down this way come by with the pup |
| My heart goes out to you! Our Border Collie Mix also had Seperation Anxiety-and it was very tough getting him through it.
Butterstotch and Tammy gave excellent advise...short periods of seperation adding longer time spans and LOTS of praise. The only thing that we found was to remain calm and quite when you came back to them. This helped to keep them calm (and also helped with the excited peeing). After he remained calm, treats and hugs were given. The second thing that was a wonder for us was a kong filled with peanut butter. Murphy would see that and run for his crate!!! He was just so excited to see it! I waited outside for the first couple of times to see how long before he finished all of the peanut butter...and I was suprised to see that he took his time and enjoyed it. We continued to add time to how long we stayed away from him, and slowly he improved. I am very happy to say that he is now 2 years old and is wonderful! He still gets his kong, but now as a night-time treat. He no longer is in the crate when we leave and is not crying, eating carpeting or harming furniture any more. And we are greeted by he and and his 4 legged brother at the door with lots of love. Good Luck! |
| We are going through a terrible time with separation anxiety. We even posted a message on behavior section about panic attacks. Milo is 6 and was never crate trained, but has developed this panic over the last year that is heart breaking. You can read the thread if your interested; but it does pertain to an older dog, with a new development. |
| Well, you can try leaving the crate up in a room where you will spend a lot of time. Keep the crate open, put in nice (washable) bedding and try putting her food or at least treats in the kennel. Make it a safe place which she associates with nice things and security, not with being left.
My husband is not a fan of crates at all so we've never crated our dogs. What we have done when we had to leave younger dogs who might soil or chew or otherwise get into trouble is to instead of crating them, confining them to a room with linoleum floors that has been puppy proofed as much as possible. A friend at work rescued a Springer spaniel who had terrible seperation anxiety. He is an adult, and fully house trained, but when they put him in a crate so they could go to work, he still got into terrible trouble: he could reach things they thought far, far out of his reach, moved the crate and even broke part of the crate. This was AFTER the vet put him on 2 different anti-anxiety medications. What they decided to do after the crate breaking incident (in which the dog was caught partially in the crate, and thankfully not injured) was to not crate him. End of problem. No destruction, no soiling or wetting. They are weaning him from the meds so it's not a done deal but its far more successful than any of their other strategies (which included leaving on the television or radio with talking, treats, etc.) |
| If anxiety is severe and the dog is truly suffering from the condition, medications might be part of the "cure".
My rescue arrived with severe separation anxiety about 2 1/2 years ago. The kind where the dog is destructive, poops/pees in a their crate even while in there for short periods of time, drooled, whined, howled forlornly, would not settle, etc. After trying to use the crate for maybe 3 days, we took it down and used a puppyproof room instead. We used a medication called Clomipramine or Clomicalm for about a year along with behavior modification and building trust... we were able to ween her off the meds. She's remained an exuberant girl. We just got back from the vet-on-call. She had diarrhea... the first bout we've had in the pack in maybe a couple of years. It was the kind that did not clear up within 24 hours when giving Kaopectate and withholding food for 24 hours. Diagnosis- cholitis due to stress... a pretty severe case with blood but the vet says she'll be fine. Our son was home for a couple of days and she adores him but it was too much excitement. Stress can do wacky things. Here's a link with ways to try to overcome separation anxiety- http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Conten ... ourceID=42 Heading off to research colitis... |
| Thanks to all of you for the great advice! I did get her a Kong and one of those DAP's. I dont think that she knows what to do with the Kong, because she doesnt seem to like it, and there are peanut butter treats in it! Today I am going to give it to her again, and see if she will start to play with it.
Thanks again for all the help, I will keep you posted, and I do have to get her a new bed for inside the crate!!!! THe last one, even though it was washable was destroyed!!! |
Quote: I do have to get her a new bed for inside the crate!!!! THe last one, even though it was washable was destroyed!!!
Just an idea if this new bed doesn't work out well- We found that twin size comforters work very well. We fold them in quarters so it's nice an soft. They're easier to put in the wash than traditional doggie beds. They might be on sale now too since we're heading into summer  |
ANichols wrote: She does have one problem that I could use some advice with. After the first few times (she was great then...) she began to soil her crate, and then spread it everywhere!!!!
The problem is that now, instead of soiling the crate, I think that she is panting and barking the whole time we are gone, because her face is all wet when we get home. Patch was so confused when I got her - she was in and out home after home. She did NOT like it when I left the house - one day she not only went on the floor but walked through it and spread the wealth all over. I never had a crate - not becuase I didn't like them, I just didn't have one so I put up baby gates on the first floor that was all wood floors. She eventually came around and has been fine ever since. I personally think it takes 6 months for everyone to get acquainted and settled. |
| Thanks! I will try the comforter today, I have plenty of those!!!!! I moved the kennel into the bedroom, that is where she sleeps at night with us, in the bed of course!!!
I think it may take awhile too for us to get a routine down. Now we have had her for only a month, but already she has come out of her shell. Now she barks when people come into the house, before she ran and hid on the couch! I wasnt even sure that she could bark the first few weeks! I read that putting peanut butter in the Kong might be a good way to try it! Can you use regular peanut butter, or is there some special dog type butter I need to use???? If not I have some wet food that I know she likes!!!! Thanks again for all the great advice. I just want her to be happy, it breaks my heart to see her so upset!!!! Amber |
Quote: If not I have some wet food that I know she likes!!!!
We've taken wet food, stuffed the kongs and put them in the freezer so it takes longer to work the food out. http://oesusa.com/Kongs.jpg It gives the dog something to focus on... getting that darn food out of that toy! I've got a couple of aggressive chewers so we had to go with the black kongs instead. This is what Emma did to a red kong in one sitting... I was lucky she didn't ingest it  http://oesusa.com/ChewPower.jpg .
We used just regular ol' peanut butter when we did it. My girls had a problem with yeast on their feet (chewing/licking) so we had to make changes in their diet and go with different kong stuffers. |
| i know this might not be the answer but duffy just wanted no part of the crate the problem is derby i felt bad for him listening to the pup cry and bark for 3 hours or so . sunday i got him so tired out and went out leaving them alone together for 3 hours i came home they were both quiet and sleeping one little accident my fault i left the water down , i go out to the gym every morning for couple of hours well he never even barked when i left rushed home and again both just sleeping no accidents.. i just close all the doors and steps seems to be working ,, |
| She seems to be doing better. She loves the peanut butter, and I put her in the Kennel when I take a shower, and make the bed and what not! Then when I go to class, she barks when I am downstairs, but when I walk out the door, she stops.....because hubby says she isnt barking when he gets home to let her out (which is only 10 mins or so after I leave).
Thanks again..... She seems to only like the Kong if I am in the room, but when I leave she doesnt use it. Maybe that will pass! Amber |
| Glad she's improving Amber! That's great news!
Just curious, what are you putting in the kongs? |
| I put peanut butter (regular) and peanut butter treats, that cam with the Kong!
Actually, just when I though she was more comfortable with us leaving, we went out Friday evening with some friends to dinner, and then we invited them to our house after dinner. Well we came home to a dog, crate, and bedroom covered in poo! Not so much fun, and we had to make our friends wait outside, while we cleaned her, and the room up..... Sooooo, I called the vet Saturday morning, and she is wonderful. She has met Agatha twice already, and loves her. She suggested that just for awhile, we give her a pill for upset stomachs, and a pill for anxiety prior to us leaving just to help her cope with the idea that we are gone. Today will be our first try, while we go to Lowes and Car shopping. We are not going to put her into the crate, but we have a sunroom off the living room, and we are just going to live in there with two baby gates stacked on eachother (because she is a jumper) that way if she does have diarrhea, she will not have to stand in it, or throw it around! Wish us luck! I felt guilty about the drugs at first. But, we are not doing it for us, we are doing it because it breaks our heart that she gets so upset when we are gone, and we want her to be comfortable!!!! Hope all of you are doing well! Amber |
ANichols wrote: Wish us luck! I felt guilty about the drugs at first. But, we are not doing it for us, we are doing it because it breaks our heart that she gets so upset when we are gone, and we want her to be comfortable!!!!
Amber exactly!! imagine how she feels when she gets so scared because you leave. the medication will help her feel better. |
| Thanks for the reassurance! It is for her to be more comfortable, and hopefully after a few more months she will get more comfortable here, and with us leaving her!
We gave her the meds yesterday around 1:30pm and left at 2:30pm. When we came home around 6pm, she seemed to be a lot more calm. She was able to somehow yank the baby gate down (not sure how!) and she peed on the dining room floor. But that was it, and there was no poo to be found, she didnt get into anything, and her beard was dry, so I am assuming that she didnt pant or bark while we were gone! Although a funny thing happened, around 8pm that evening we went to take her out for a walk, and she was swaying like a drunken sailor! And she didnt seem to know that she was outside. When we brought her back in, we looked at her eyes, and she was stoned!!! What we couldnt figure out was why it was kicking in so strong 8 hours after we gave it to her! She was fine last night, and just slept peacefully until this morning. So I think that pills seem to be a good stepping stone for now. I just need to figure out how to get the baby gate up so that she cant yank it down, and perhaps maybe give her the pills a few hours sooner before we leave! Hope all of you are doing well. Thanks again for all your help, and for letting me vent! Amber |
| It might just take her time to adjust to the medications or her level of meds may have to be adjusted/lowered until you find just the right dose. Monitor her closely... you don't want her in a drunken stupor but just relaxed enough to take off the edge. Panda was prescribed the generic form of Clomicalm... the full dosage made her too sleepy so we went with half the dose because it was just enough to curb her anxiety.
Also, think "Dutch door" if you continue to have problems with the baby gate. http://oesusa.com/AboutU249.jpg They are sturdy, close securely and the dog can jump up on it and see over but cannot knock it down. |
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