Pulling on neck/leash
As previously posted I am searching for answers for or dog Kayla's behavior, but had one question regarding pulling her forcefully by the leash. We are working very hard and the OFF and STAY command and if for instance she is barking at us while we are on the couch I am leading her by her leash to the other side of the room and commanding her to stay. Same with the bed we are trying to get her down with the off command as well. My question is that Kayla being as stubborn as she can be will almost always freeze up and put all of her weight into resisting us and pulling in the opposite direction (especially on the bed) we need to be in charge, but I also do not want to hurt her what would you suggest? It is especially difficult on the bed where she does not want to come down. My wife and I have been pulling pretty hard on the leash to get her down, and Kayla is very very strong so I need to know if this is all that bad and can we injure her neck in any way. We will be woring with a trainer in the next few weeks and these are some of the things she suggested we work on. Thank You, Jay |
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what about a small yummy treat to get her to move with a command word?? We have to do his on our walks in the woods... we have jerky and yell come... just so if we need them to come fast they will. Blue was the one that would just keep going... but with jerky he is the first to come sit and stay....just a thought. They may be stuborn but they LIKE treats better.  |
| I would suggest that instead of a traditional collar, perhaps while you are working on this issue, you use a Gentle Leader or Halti on her. This way, you are not putting any pressure on her neck at all and when she pulls away from you, the resistance will not hurt her. |
Beaureguard's Mom wrote: I would suggest that instead of a traditional collar, perhaps while you are working on this issue, you use a Gentle Leader or Halti on her. This way, you are not putting any pressure on her neck at all and when she pulls away from you, the resistance will not hurt her.
Actually the GL can hurt their neck if they pull the wrong way. I never thought I could live without mine but I have been GL less for over two months now (although when we go somewhere new they are tucked in the dog bag as a security blanket for me  )
If treats don't work, a properly fitted prong collar is the safest. |
| Stop pulling your dog. She has no idea what that means, and is fighting you. Much better to find a way to get her to comply without force.
Teach her to do things, by first luring her into position with a treat, then rewarding her. Give it a name/cue. Then hide the treat and use the cue to ask her to do it, and then use the treat as a reward. My dogs have no leashes or collors on them inside the house. |
| my Chief is a puller....he fights all the time....sometimes it is wonderful others I think my arm is six inches longer than it was...I have just gotten a Gentle Lead...not bad...we are working on it...both of us have to be trained....but I have had it for two days and have already noticed a difference.......I just couldn't end up in the mud...it was bad enough when he pulled me in the snow bank....but now with it melting...he has to learn that I am in charge.......... |
| there is an interesting discussion on another list I am on about leaning into your dog when they pull. its for more reactive situations but it makes you think. Pulling a dog usually makes them pull back. I agree luring is the way to go. But I have to admit I have never had a dog that didn't respond to the "mom" voice. |
| Hello,
I have appreciated all of the advice and suggestions and I just wanted to pass along some information on how much Kayla's behavior has improved in just one short week. I agree with most on thos thread and she should never be forcefully pulled, but rather lured into moving. We now have a leash on her that is cut so that it cannot tangle with her and when she does try to show dominace we simply lead her away from where we are and have her sit and lie down with a repeated stay command. Then we give her positive attention for this. It has worked wonders as instead of repetitive barking, chasing and us yelling at her to stop, it has calmed the whole situation down, and she is actually listening. Last night she was as good as she has ever been and let all of us eat our dinner and watch television as well. She did bark once and we got a handle on it and she just went over to her favorite spot on the hardwood floor in front of the door and just relaxed all night. I am absolutley thrilled at how well she has been and it only makes me want to work even harder with her. Thank you again. Jay |
kerry wrote: Pulling a dog usually makes them pull back.
Yup. There's even a name for: opposition reflex. You use the principle in obedience to solidify a stand-stay. Press down on dog's withers and dog will square up and press up against your hand. You use a restrained recall technique to teach the dog to come directly at speed when called (especially useful with young puppies and a fun game to play). I've used it in physical therapy at the PTs instruction to get Mad to straighten up as she put all of her weight on her good side and her spine started to curve: instead of pushing on the good side towards the weak side to shift her weight back more evenly (which would make her fight the force), I'd lightly push her weak side and she'd pop back into position. IN part to keep from falling over, but also because of a natural inclination to push back when pushed. . You can use it in agility, to get a dog excited, say about the weaves - the more you hold them back (are you ready? are you ready?) the more they lean forward, ready to go. And when you release them, they explode off the start. It's a really interesting concept. And like Kerry suggests, once you understand it you may rethink the way you use a leash. http://www.rainbowag.com/pet_news/palmer12.html Kristine |
Bosley's mom wrote: Stop pulling your dog. She has no idea what that means, and is fighting you. Bosley's mom wrote: Stop pulling your dog. She has no idea what that means, and is fighting you. Much better to find a way to get her to comply without force.
i could not agree more!!!!!!! i didn't want this to turn into an essay, but there is so much i want to say to you to help you with your kayla. i've read your other posts on the troubles you are having, and i'm bunching them all together in this reply. please accept my humble advise, not as a trained specialist, but as a mother of six children and owner of many animals large and small. if you physically force someone or something to do what you want--that does not equate, nor does it teach obedience. having a dog is (i hate to do this---because animals are not people, but...) similar to having a child. if your child will not open their mouth to get their teeth brushed, to wrestle them down to the floor while forcing their mouth open will never accomplish anything other than clean teeth. after wrestling in like manner for a time on a daily basis, the child may eventually give in to the procedure. but then there will be other issues that the child will not obey, like the brushing of hair, the picking up of toys, respectful behavior, and so on, and so on. you will be obliged to physically force, moving the child's arms, legs, head, and mouth, to achieve every standard you set forth because the child was not taught how to, or even why to obey you, the parent. discipline, obedience, and self-discipline equal a peaceful and pleasurable existence. the first, discipline: you must, whether it is a child or a pet, express what is and what is not acceptable. rarely if ever, will it be assumed that you are correct. but you're the boss, so what you say goes!!! when your opponent (dog or child) thinks they know better, and will not take heed to your loving authority and well meaning (for their own good) prompting, you must enforce it by implementing the appropriate punishment. for a pup, a disapproving, very animated "noooo!" may be all that's needed in some situations or conflicts. for other's it may require the tap of a rolled up newspaper to get your point across. but with lots of praise for the pup's good behavior (good behavior, meaning that when you said "no!", or tapped his bottom, he stopped what he was doing!) immediately after his punishment, the pup learns that you are very happy when he listens to you, (and he wants to please you so!) and thus, you have crossed the first bridge! then comes obedience: every time a pup turns around there is something else they're not allowed to do!!!! it's a continual learning experience for them. they don't know the rules. they have to learn by trial and error, so to speak! with each "new" rule, the pup applies what he has learned from the past corrections that you used when disciplining him. he puts it together and says, "ahh! not good either, huh? well, i'm sorry about that. i'll stop and you pet me. how's that?" another bridge crossed! then we are left with the grand and wonderful self-discipline!: self-discipline is achieved when the pup has learned all the rules (well, alot of them anyway!) and chooses to adhere to them. oh, he may want to jump up on strangers and give them great big licks, but he maintains himself. he would love to bark at you with ear piercing yelps for attention, but he knows you hate that, so he presses his lips tight and bites his tongue (not very hard!) and wags his body instead. he would love to lay on the bed 'cause it's so comfy-cozy, but you said he had to sleep on the floor, so he does, and that by your bedside. dinner time for the family sure smells good, so he'd like nothing more than a baked potato with butter, thank you, while he sat at the table with you. but....he doesn't even look up to the table even though he's hungry. now that's self-discipline!! and with that bridge, you and your pup have arrived! don't get fooled, though. nobody's perfect. even the best behaved children and dogs do things that aren't so good. they will continue to make mistakes. but that's why they have you, the smart one (well, comparatively speaking!). you're there to love and guide them. if you do these things you will have great success with pup or child. making some minor adjustments in the case of a child--i hope!!! of course, a child grows into an adult, and your job as parent is basically done, other than maybe supplying money or unwanted advise! but, although a pup gets bigger and we call him a dog now, he's really more like peter pan in never never land. he will always need you, and not just for a "loan". he will always want your attention and love. and, probably, always have to be told not to eat from the trash can or drink from toilets! sincerely, Lora |
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