Thyroid, very low
While I was with Dr. Debacco, I asked if Keira could have low thyroid function. The Dr. asked why I thought so? I told her that while Kiera has always been fat, from the day we adopted her, she was a chunk, but it seemed to me that she had gained more weight, her fur was very thin and very dull, skin was really dry and flaky. The Dr. told me that could be another disease too, so she felt around her skull and her legs and agreed that it might be thyroid issues. She feels that the muscle mass on her skull was lacking as well as her legs being spindly. We did the blood work and sure enough, it came back as low as can be measured. We started her on some meds and already she seems brighter and more alert, much less of a fur slug these days. I understand that she may even get more active and lose some weight. Does anyone have any experience with this? |
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Sorry, I don't know much about thryroid, but congratulations for educating your vet!  |
| Oh, I wasn't educating her, she is pretty sharp. I think what she was getting at was since I live with her and know her better than the vet does. So she felt that I would have good insight. |
| Glad you found out what the problem is. Hopefully she is will start losing weight soon and be healthier. |
| Not only did our first dog have hypothyroid, but Joan does too!
Dogs take massive doses compared to humans, so I'd be careful about handling the pills too much with your bare hands, and I'd wash after being in contact with them. One thing we learned about thyroid replacement is that it is not extremely dose critical its effects are long lasting, so missing a day wouldn't be the end of the world, so don't worry if you forget! Yes, improvement continues for some time. How long ago did you start? Good luck, I hope you continue to see improvement. |
| One of my former OES's, Oliver, was hypothyroid. He went on twice a day thyroid supplement at about 2 years old. His weight dropped dramatically over the first two months and he was completely normal while on the meds for the rest of his life.
The thyroid supplements were fairly expensive from my vet but I found that I could get 1000 tabs from vetmeddirect.com for under $40 and had the vet write me a prescription. Oliver lived until he was 8 when he died within 2 weeks of my 14 year old male, Freddie, his life-long buddy. Nothing to do with his thyroid condition, he just didn't want to go on without Freddie, I think. No one can ever convince me that sheepdogs do not mourn the loss of a family member. Here is Oliver nibbling Freddie's neck-- one of my favorite pictures of the two of them.  |
| a bit technical:
Quote: Biochemical therapeutic monitoring is required because of variable individual response to treatment; dose adjustments are required in approximately half of all patients.6 Therapeutic monitoring of serum TT4 and cTSH levels should be started beginning four to eight weeks after starting supplementation. Serum TT4 concentrations should be measured at six- to eight-week intervals during the first six to eight months of treatment, because metabolism of T4 will change when the metabolic rate normalizes and dosage adjustments may be necessary. Once adequate serum TT4 concentrations are documented and the dog’s dosage has stabilized, frequency of measurement of serum TT4 may be decreased to once or twice a year.7 http://www.vet.uga.edu/vpp/clerk/bell/
Also Dr. Jean Dodd's: http://www.apubasenjis.com/OVMAProc1.htm Dr. Dodd has been studying OES and thyroid problems for years. She's in Santa Monica. |
We just started Morgan on meds on Monday for a low thyroid. I swear he is more energetic already! the good news is the vet said it would also be easy to recognize an overdose of the meds because he would become very active and energetic (sort of like a normal sheepie)  |
| That's great news, Leslie, that Kiera is improving already. Good call on having the vet check for it. |
| Just in case you don't read Dr. Dodd's article, here's a quote you might want to show to your vet:
Quote: The twelve breeds most affected were the Golden Retriever (209 cases), Shetland Sheepdog (124), American Cocker Spaniel (68), Boxer (51), Doberman Pinscher (42), Labrador Retriever (40), German Shepherd (19), Akita (15), Irish Setter (14), English Setter (13), Old English Sheepdog (12), and Collie (10), although many other breeds and mixed breeds were also represented. All of these dogs also would be expected to have elevated levels of TgAA. In fact, all 75 dogs selected for testing at random from this case cohort had high TgAA levels.[/url] |
| In an article from U of Mi the OES was listed as number 2 brhind the Golden for the period of the study. |
| We rescued Sassy a year ago from a Michigan kill shelter. Sadly, the animal control officer told her rescuer that "nobody would want THAT dog!" We have no idea of her age but think she's around 7-8 yrs. old. She had an eye infection so we took her directly to the vet on the way home. It was hard to tell how fat she really was through her matted coat but we could tell her back legs were, like you described, "spindly", and her front end was quite muscular. As soon as we shaved her down we realized her problems went much deeper.
Sassy's coat was very thin, her skin was dry and flaky. She was constantly cold and enjoyed wearing a sweatshirt and laying in direct sunlight. She could barely walk outdoors to potty. We took her back to the vet and she weighed in at 99 lbs.. She's not a large-framed dog, just overweight. I insisted on having a thyroid panel done. My vet didn't argue with me but I'm not convinced he would have suggested it. Of course, it came back extremely low and she's been on meds for a year. She's alert, much more active, has a thick coat with healthy looking skin. Her back legs are still spindly but she has the energy to pull us on a walk. Best of all, she's lost 18 lbs.! She still has a bad attitude when things don't go her way but we've learned to co-exist. I'd recommend anyone with a dog that exhibits any of these symptoms to have a thyroid panel run. It cost less than $100 and if your dogs is hypothyroidic, the medication is inexpensive and easy to administer. Don't wait for your vet to suggest it. Since there aren't an abundance of Old English Sheepdogs, your vet may never have treated one and may be unfamiliar with their breed-specific problems. Sassy, looking healthier after about 6 months on thyrotabs:  |
| That's a great picture of Sassy, Nita. She sure looks happy & healthy there. |
| Thanks to everyone for the wonderful responses. Kiera is my darling little "girl" and just had this feeling something was not quite right with her.
I'm so glad that we did the panel and that its really an easy "fix" with the meds. So far "we" have been on them for about two weeks and the biggest change so far is the brightness in her eyes and interest in what is going on around her. Again, thanks for the feed back. Not that I want anyone else to have ailing OES, but it's nice to know that someone else has had experience with it. Leslie |
| Leslie, two of my boys have been on thyroid meds for several years and are doing great with it. Luke's coat (not perfect to start with) is really thin in some areas and doesn't grow much, but Rosco's is still thick although black in some spots where the hair grew back (he's 9.5). What dosage is Kiera on? |
| Kiera is on 7mg twice per day.... The biggest difference I have noticed so far and she has just been on them for 2 weeks, is that she appears more interested in what is going on around her. I hope that some of her excess baggage (weight) starts to drop.... please lord, just 15 pounds would make a huge difference.... |
| She'll start to lose weight, when the meds get adjusted she'll get some energy back and move more. That seems like a huge dose though, Rosco is .1 and Luke is .08, maybe different brands have different dosages. |
bestdogsx4 wrote: That seems like a huge dose though, Rosco is .1 and Luke is .08, maybe different brands have different dosages. .125 and .088 sound like human doses of synthroid... Something to check into. |
Ron wrote: bestdogsx4 wrote: That seems like a huge dose though, Rosco is .1 and Luke is .08, maybe different brands have different dosages. .125 and .088 sound like human doses of synthroid... Something to check into.What I meant was 1.0 and .8, it's so hard being blonde  |
| I'm so sorry, I asked my husband to check the dose and he is who told me that it was 7mg, but the truth is that its 0.7mg. Lot less than what I thought...
sorry for the miss information    |
| Kiera is doing so much better. Still much more interested in what is going on around her, still pretty bitchy with the other dogs, but that would have been a miracle if that had changed. She got this really bad dander for a while, but that seems to be looking better. I did use up Lee’s TGel to bath her at the local dog wash. Her fur has come back in and she no longer looks as if she needs a toupee for her butt. She has lost weight and here is what I’m more amazed at, Kiera has been historically the gassiest dog I have ever been in contact with and often smelled like the bottom of a hamster cage, not pleasant. She rarely farts anymore and her breath is better and the aroma of the hamster cage is gone. She looks amazing and happy and is getting up easier too. I will take photos soon and share.
Thanks to everyone for the encouragement! |
| Great update! I hope she continues to improve. |
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