My OES rescue bites
He suffers from arthritis in his back and legs, so needs help getting up on all fours, I had him as a foster first that is when I found out about his condition. I kept him as he was deemed non adoptable by the group I work with. He won't let anyone groom him so I have to take him to the Vet to be shaved about twice a year. I love him very much but need help with the biting, he nips but that I can live with as it's his nature. I got a muzzle and use that when there is a chance he might bite, when being lifted from an awkward position or when I wash him. I don't like the alternative for Mitchell so I will go the extra mile to help him. |
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| Is Mitchell on any pain medication? If his pain isn't under control, that would certainly explain why he bites, especially if it is limited to when he has to be moved and it is uncomfortable. If you haven't discussed this with your vet, this is the very first step for all of your sakes.
How do you move him? Our first OES had a problem with compressed vertebrae at the end of his life, which caused him to lose control of his back legs. We got a wheel chair for him (I am not sure I'd go that route again--expensive and for an older dog--Merlin was 13--not an easy thing to learn) and also a sort of sling that fit onto the wheel chair, but could also be used to help him move without a chair. It was specially made for him, using his measurements. It looked like a sort of soft, reverse saddle, with a pair of handles. It made it much easier for him to get up and down, and later, for us to support him as he walked. It was totally washable. I found it on http://www.doggon.com but I know that there are other makers of such aids. I mention this because you seem very committed to Mitchell and it would obviously be in both your best interests (I'm thinking of your back as well as bites) and his (comfort, and security and freedom from pain) if you could find a reliable way to help him move as he needs to do. I know there are others who have had experience with older dogs with arthritis. Hopefully, there will be more suggestions out there. |
| I agree pain control could be a huge part of the problem. Call your vet and insist he re-evaluate his pain issue. He probably needs something stronger. If he walks okay after getting up, as you mentioned in your signature section, in addition to increased pain contol you may try a sling ( there are several makers ), to help him up instead of your arms. |
| Thanks for the replies, I had him on Rimadyl(sp) and I now use K9 Aspirin.
I lift him by getting my hands under his back legs at the top, if he has been sitting or laying for a while, his right rear leg is usually very sensitive until it warms up. I did buy two different supports for him, he is still trying to get used to them, one that fits over his rear legs doesn't fit very well because of his thick fur, the other goes around his chest or belly, it helps to get him up the stairs but he has no confidence in it for going down stairs, I have to carry him down. I just wish he trusted us more, and know we love him and are trying to make him comfortable. thanks again, Peter. |
| Oh, bless your heart Peter! You are doing such a wonderful thing with Mitchell! It's obvious that he is in pain and that's why he bites. I agree with everybody else to control his pain.
Give him time to trust you. I wish we could just tell them, "Hey, it's going to be unpleasant for a little bit but it will be so much better after that! ". Keep up the good work!  |
| I don't think this is anything to do with trust , If something hurts you and takes you by surprise you'd yell out and maybe shout ......sometimes at whoever was close by even if you knew it wasn't really their fault and dogs do the same thing by either growling or biting , I'm sure it's a reflex action .
You're doing a great Job . Julie . |
| Try the supports from dogonwheels: they are expensive but made specifically for each individual dog. To me, they were worth it.
Merlin was 100 lbs and always in full coat, but his sling (used for his back end) fit very well. It was a bit of a pain to get him in and out, but we could leave it on for the day. We got two, so one could be washed if need be (and at the end of his life, this became an issue, but he was older than your rescue). This helped Merlin immensely, and saved our backs. This was especially important as Merlin's issue came up during a Minnesota winter, full of snow and ice, so we were worried about falling ourselves. he could do the stairs in and out of our house with the sling and our support. I agree that pain and being startled, asked to do something painful is an issue. Sure, some dogs are good at ignoring pain but not all are. |
| Peter, your a saint, it's not a trust issue it's a pain issue. Heck, when I don't feel well or hurt, I bite only with words, which are equally as hurtful.
Aspirin is probably not enough at this point. Contact your vet and insist on something to keep your guy as comfortable as possible. As a side thought, a heated dog pad may help............Kathy |
| Ask your vet about prescribing some dermaxx, that will help with the pain. I have an older boy who always needs help to get up, we massage his back legs after he stands and that seems to help him. Luke will get snappy and growl occasionally if we ask him if he wants to get up, I think
sometimes they just want to be left alone. You could also try a more full body massage by sitting on the floor with him, just avoid any areas that might be painful for him. |
| I would like to leave off getting Mitchell a dog wheels support just yet as he can still walk, although its harder for him in these cold winter days. I wont hesitate to get him the supports when I feel its time.
He is going to the groomers today, I've filled them in on his condition and they say they can work with him, he needs shaved so I may have to cover him when we go outside as the temps here are in the negatives. I will ask his vet about Dermaxx for him. thanks for the advice and support, Peter. |
| Can you strap on one of those lifting support things on his back end so you don't have to grab him? That way it would just be a quick lift from the top instead of reaching under? Some of those can be left on all the time, too. I'm going through a similar experience with my 14 year old dog and she, too, hates being lifted. She doesn't bite but she gets all grumbly and tries to fight it. Once she's up, she walks just fine but it's just getting her to her feet that's the problem. I think many times she could do it if I give her time but it kills me to watch her struggle so I swoop in and pick her up.
Good luck. I know how hard it is.  |
| I took Mitchell for his grooming, and 5 min after I left him I got a call to pick him up as he had bitten the groomer. So I will have to find a Vet that has a groomer .
He was happy when I picked him up. |
| I agree it's more about pain than trust. I think you are wonderful to be doing so much for your sheepie!
My girl is becoming particular with how she's touched on her back end and prefers to move herself when she is being brushed. Even at the vet's, a new tech attempted to manipulate her around and she was a little grumbly. I had to let them know she prefers to move herself around. Good luck to you and your sheepie. |
| On the site I mentioned, if you look, there is a support that can be left on your dog for most of the day--it isn't cheap, but it's less expensive by a lot than a wheel chair, which isn't something that I would necessarily recommend. The support/saddle was a tremendous help with Merlin. It didn't stop the progression of his disability, but it made it so much easier for us to help him in a way that he could be comfortable and we could avoid hurting ourselves. He didn't hurt so much, and we didn't hurt ourselves.
I know I am being pushy here, but I hate the thought that someone could get hurt seriously and you'd have a different--and worse--situation to deal with. |
| I tried walking Mitchell using his regular leash and a rear end support leash I purchased, and it worked out really good, due to the icy road conditions he was always slipping and falling, now he can go all the way on the walk without falling, he even peed and pooped with no problems. Success |
 Go Mitchell!!
I haven't commented yet but always read this post for updates. I'm in awe of you for having taken on a boy like Mitchell. Think he's my Panda boys twin, as they had the same medical and physical issues. It was hard work the first year but Panda is completely different now, almost 4 years after he came into my home. Just wanted to offer support and let you know there is hope! Keep up the good work! Marianne |
coonrapper wrote: I tried walking Mitchell using his regular leash and a rear end support leash I purchased, and it worked out really good, due to the icy road conditions he was always slipping and falling, now he can go all the way on the walk without falling, he even peed and pooped with no problems. Success
Yay!  (Vikings fan clapping?!) 
Peter, So good to hear that you found something that works for you and Mitchell!! I know a lot of folks state that Mitchell grumbles and bites due to pain. While that could definitely be it, you know your boy better than anyone. There *are* dogs who grumble and bite when there is nothing medically wrong with them. Some simply don't appreciate being picked up as it's not natural for them to be carried. I have one of those girls .. she's now 7, but has *never* appreciated being picked up. She too was a foster failure years back, so who knows why she doesn't appreciate it. I've also had other perfectly healthy foster dogs who simply don't care to be lifted. Did you find a vet who does grooming too? For Mitchell, a twice a year shear might be best. He's darn cuuute, isn't he?! You guys stay warm! It's cold up here in the north land, eh? Fondly, Nancy |
| I finally got Mitchel groomed at a local Vets, they did an ok job of it but they couldn't do his face very well, as they had to remove the muzzle to cut, but he wouldn't let them, and they shaved his tail it's now like a big rodents tail. I've tried doing the rest of his face with no success either, I will be taking him to get his teeth cleaned, and when he is under they can clean the hair on his face.
He bit me again 3 days ago as I was wiping some pee of him, I had to go to the Doc's as my hand got infected, I'm on antibiotics. I got some Cosequin for him I hope this helps his condition, I got 6 months supply and they say it takes 6 weeks to see any positive results.javascript:emoticon(':plead:') Pleading |
| I so admire you for your perseverance in handling Mitchell. I agree with everyone else, it is pain that is driving his biting. That being said, just make sure your own doctor doesn't report your wound as a dog bite or you may be facing his being taken away from you.
We have a very senior dog who's hips are pretty much gone. We have to help her to stand but once she's standing, she can walk reasonably well. We have a back leash that we really don't like. We have to slip each back leg in a loop, then pull her up with the leash end. Not easy from our end, and it must hurt her too because she's also a grumbler. As for stairs, my husband cups her rear-end and lifts both back legs up so that she only walks up on her front legs. Going down is a bit trickier. One of us stands a few steps down from her and we put one arm under her belly, back by her legs. She comes down on her front legs, we hold up her rear legs. Although this works, she's becoming increasingly fearful coming down, even though she knows we won't drop her. Good luck! |
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