Arghhhhhhhhhhhhhh walking and pulling
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Murphy's Mom wrote: I have read that six months old is a time he will test and act like he has not had training. Do they get out of this and listen?
If it's any consolation, Nelson was around six months old when we took him to obedience class. He paid absolutely no attention to us or the trainer and just wanted to socialize. It wasn't a waste of time because everything we learned we took home and accomplished successfully. As he got older he became more focused on learning and is no longer easily distracted. As far as pulling, what method are your trainers using to resolve this? Our trainer allowed use of Haltis or Gentle Leaders but wanted us to teach our dogs by stopping in our tracks when they pulled and not moving again until the leash went slack. A long but effective process. Good luck! |
| Heart is seven months so I am at the same stage you are--- It is hard for her to focus on me especially when we practice heeling or walking without pulling.....
Her past class was in the evening, so I did not feed her before class. I have found that if she is hungry, she will respond to treats alot better. I hold the treat to my face with a "look at me" and then give her the treat. I have been doing this since we began classes at 12 weeks. We still have to practice the "watch me" often. Now, when we walk, if there is something that gets her interest, I will repeat, watch me. and she looks at me for the treat, breaking her interest on whatever she is obsessing about. Also...I have found that if I run her in the back yard before class to get her a little tired, she is much more calm and focused-- I do this before a walk also... Good Luck!!!! |
| Oh. I feel your pain. Nigel is 7 1/2 months and a brat. We start basic obedience next week. I have to handle Bella so I am passing him off to my 12 yr old. They are both adolescents. LOL. It should be interesting. |
| I am not alone. The method to stop pulling the trainer at home uses is the same as the one at obedience class - have him sit and look at me or turn in the other direction. It does work when there are no other people or animals. Treats are not allowed by either trainer. Will see what the obedience class does tonight. We have had the home trainer since 9 weeks old and have done all the basic obedience training. then started the obedience class (now attended for four sessions) because i wanted him to be with distractions while we train. tonight is a different one - still basic obedience - this one the home trainer recommended. the home trainer is coming tomorrow morning. YEAH! I cannot longer take the pulling - the pain in the neck, arms and hands is too much - went to chiro today and a massage. the minute i picked murphy up from day care, he pulled and i have pain. i just might get the gentle leader to save me. the trainers will have to train him on the choke lead. as you can see, i am frustrated and thought this would be over by five months old since we started training at 9 weeks. i do get him exercise before obedience class - i have to watch because sometimes he is too tired to hold a sit and lies down. he behaves a lot better at home after a few hours at the day care, a long walk or a visit to the dog park. this training has consumed my life in the hope that it would pay off with a well trained and well mannered dog - not yet. do they get it someday? |
Murphy's Mom wrote: Treats are not allowed by either trainer.
Not allowed? Why? Use a prong collar, get help fitting it and someone to show you how to use it correctly. It looks like a torture device from the middle ages, but it's the safest thing available for a puller (yes, safer than haltis and gentle leaders and so on with which you risk wrenching the dogs neck/spine - my chiro vet backs me up on this, ) That way you have instant power steering while you try to convince boy puppy that you are more interesting than dirt. Read Heart's mom's instructions again: tired puppy, good. Hungry puppy, good. Training with treats, very good! Puppy who has learned "watch me" superb!!! 
But for right now you have to buy yourself and your aching back enough time to get a chance to play with what works best for you. Kristine |
| guys i know murphy he is a handful but so loving and way to cute.i would try the gentle leader, that will help i had derby to class yesterday and my trainer told me to start with the gentle leader again. maybe your trainers have not had a crazy lol oes before !! i have one you can try!! hope it goes better tonite.. i know derby in his first 3 classes made me look like a fool forgot all .. but seriously you might to try the leader !! |
| I wanted to suggest a prong...but I did not know how it would be recieved.
I was so against prongs before Pearl came to us. She pulled so hard that I was afraid she would hurt her trachea. Then a trainer suggested a prong (or pinch)... I was so against it!!!! Pinching MY puppy??? (she was about 9 months old at the time). He assured me the prong was safer and more humane than the choke......Showed me how to fit it correctly(so important!!). As soon as I started walking Pearl on the prong, she was a different dog. NO pulling...NO lunging...It took me about a month or 2 to begin to switch to a regular collar. I would put both collars on her and switch from prong to regular until I didn't need the prong anymore! |
sheepieshake wrote: I wanted to suggest a prong...but I did not know how it would be recieved.
Join the club. People look at them, and if you don't understand how they work, you absolutely flip out. I did too the first time I saw one! I think they may even be banned in some countries, which is a pity because you can destroy a dog's trachea with a choke collar, or their neck with the halter types, but that's fine and dandy, because they look "OK". You clearly did it exactly right - the collar is a training tool - not for life. I have one. I haven't used it for years and years, but I would in a heart beat to make an oblivious puller managable because it is actually the kinder thing to do until you can train the dog not to pull. I know, I know, it seems counter-intuitive, but looks can be deceiving. The wider expanse diffuses the pressure and the pinching (it's also some times known as a pinch collar) doesn't actually hurt, just grabs their attention - try it on your own arm some time. And the nice thing is that unlike a choke collar, the dog controls the pressure. And doesn't risk getting yanked off its feet like they can with the halter types, if you're trying to walk a Mexican Jumping Bean kind of OES (ask me how I know this  )
Kristine |
Wow! 
At 6 months they are teenagers and they are testing us BUT you've had a trainer since he was 9 weeks old???? And now you have 2!!! trainers? And Murphy is STILL pulling you? How does your trainer feel about it? I mean I wouldn't like to have a client for 4 months and see no results. I would be very ashamed! Murphy should be an angel by now. I'm sorry if it comes out to harsh but have you thought about looking for another trainer?
And what's wrong with Gentle leaders? I don't understand that either. If used properly just like pinch, choke and prong collars it does work and it is NOT harmful or inhumane for the dog. It is obvious that he is far to distracted by people or other animals. Your trainers should use a different technique if one doesn't work. Murphy's Mom wrote: Treats are not allowed by either trainer.
What???? Why? 
Next time you are on a walk with him take some hot dogs with you and when Murphy sees another dog or person show him the hot dog. If he turns and follows the hot dog than give him a little piece. Food is one of the BEST motivation for dogs. I don't understand your trainers philosophy. Sorry. 
Your health should also be one of your trainers priority. If you get hurt, you can't work with Murphy - no results - and you can't take him to obedience class, which means your second trainer doesn't get paid.
You can always email me if you have other training questions! I hope you are feeling better after the massage! |
| Not for sure why OES's seem to be so prone to pulling?
When I took my sheepie to obedience school it was the same thing. I thought for sure the pinch collar was a torture device and was not about to try it. Nothing else seemed to work. When I tried the Haltie, he just stiffened his neck and powered through it (nice stubborn sheepie trait). I got fed up one night at obedience school and borrowed a pinch collar. Worked like a charm. Bought one the next day. It is the only thing that works. We also use it when we run but make sure to never use it when your dog is unattended. I aslo take it off when we get moving in the car as I'm afraid he might be injured if someone hits us. |
| Another option to try is a harness that has a clip on the chest rather than the back. With a traditional harness, as you likely know, when the dog pulls he ends up just walking on his hind legs. With the chest clip harness, when he pulls, you pull the leash every so slightly to the side and he ends up having to turn around to face you. I am still working a bit on the pulling with Tucker, but it is a lot better than without it. I walked an 8 month old lab the other day and I thought I was going to lose my arm completely, and that was with the leash looped around her body to form a make-shift harness. I find that Tucker tends to pull most right at the beginning of the walk when he is most excited to be outside, and after about 5 minutes he calms right down and walks right besdie me. I shorten up the leash so he only has about 2 feet of length to work with, and just loosen it if he needs to walk on the grass to pee. |
| Yes he should be an angel by now since we have had a home trainer for four months and all the work I do with him. We did lose the month of December with the home trainer. The other trainer is an obedience class that i started just to have him in an environment with distractions. I would love to go on to agility with him. boy that will take a long time.
Last night I started with another obedience class that the home trainer recommended - it was much better and they use treats! YEAH it works! DUH i have always trained other dogs with treats and was successful but i have never had a sheepie before and was so convinced by the home trainer that if i use treats murphy would not listen to me. ha! i spoke with the home trainer last night - she is coming this morning. we will be going to petco/shopping center - see what see does with the pulling. but i am going to try the prong and the gentle leader - see what works best. i need to at least use those when i am in need of them and use the nylon choke when in training (with treats). the home trainer is all about commands by tone of voice and positive rewards by voice . today she better switch methods or she is done., i will keep up with the obedience class we started last night, thanks for all your help. you are amazing group! Carol and Murphy and Harley and Emma |
| I read the section of dog rules on your website. this is how we have been doing it - except without treats or the halti collar. love your rules - printed them out.
I do have a problem with the husband training - he does not follow the rules as i do nor does he walk murphy much. can he undo what i have done during the day? i am with murphy all the time - my husband maybe an hour at night and a little time on the weekends. also i have been bringing murphy (not the husband) to a dog park. does the free running undo anything? my backyard is not fenced so I have to go to the dog park or visit Suzy (Derby's mom) for exercise. Murphy also goes to daycare once or twice a week. there it is free fun all day. is this not a good thing? |
| Trainer was here this morning. I borrowed a collar - Canny collar - it is much like the gentle leader. worked well. we went to petco and murphy did not pull. we walk a lot and was better.
the website for the canny collar is: cannyco.com. i will test it for a week. we will see, so far it is good. |
| It has been a few months since I wrote about the pulling issue. It is now not a problem. The canny collar, more training and Murphy growing up a little has worked wonders. He has graduated from Obedience school and now in agility. he loves agility and does very well. It is fun for me too! We both look forward to it. Murphy now stays by side off lease - at agility. I am amazed what a wonderful family member and love of my life he has become - also my shih tzu's best friend! Thanks for all your advice. Oh also the husband is now walking Murphy every night on the golf course. They both come home tired - their bonding is nice to see. So all is happy here! |
Yeah!!!!  Congratulations!!! I am so proud of you!!! You did an amazing job, well done!   |
| PRONG - I agree!
Most people feel really strongly one way or the other about these. For a large working-breed I think it's the only way to go. Winny was a tremendous puller when we got her (even stronger than my 130 lb rottweiler!) After trying for months with positive reinforcement and even a rope harness I pulled out my old prong collar that we used on my rottweiler before he passed away. She immediately responded to it like magic! It does not cause her pain and she cannot pull/choke herself with it like a conventional collar. Now we just use a regular collar because the prong helped her learn to heel. |
| Just yesterday Joan, Mulligan and I were at the nursing home celebrating our neighbor's 95th birthday. I could see a few people who were there were glancing at Mulligan's prong collar so I took it off of him and put it around my own neck and yanked on it a few times. People were very surprised by this spectacle!
Then I took it off and explained that while I fully understood how it looks very painful and frightening, it doesn't hurt at all. I doesn't hurt me with my tender neck and it doesn't hurt Mulligan, and that it was necessary to avoid having Joan pulled off her feet by a distraction. Without it on, Mulligan pulls and pulls and pulls -- while wearing it he almost never pulls, and NEVER pulls hard. |
| Dusty is now 9months old and I thought that she would NEVER stop pulling on her lead!! My only advice would be to be patient and keep up with the training...I thought I was wasting my time with all the training because she wasnt listening, but all of a sudden the other week I said heal, thinking I would get the same response as always, but she actually came to my side!! I was completely shocked!!!
GOOD LUCK X |
| I'm sure you have solved your problem by now but I simply had to respond because I was in the same boat. My puppy Annabella at seven months was killing me with her pulling. I was in a head-on collision in December and simply could not walk my baby anymore because of it.
One day my mother called and asked me to try the collar which simply goes over their nose... people will think it's a muzzle.... this collar also attaches around the neck and it's lead is under their chin. I reluctantly purchased it and gave it a shot. Annabella is the best behaved dog in the neighborhood now. This collar prevents them from pulling painlessly. If they try to pull it causes their nose to go down and if they continued it would send them heel over head... so they don't. In the beginning she fussed a bit with the nose thing but I kept it going and now she doesn't even notice it. Try it if you haven't! It is a miracle collar! |
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