Anyone see "Sicko" yet?
Last year our (husband & I who ) insurance policy went from $875 a month for a crappy Aetna HMO plan, all the way to $1150 a month after I had an overnight hospital stay with a deep vein thrombosis. It actually ended up forcing my husband to take a corporate full-time position just to get health care coverage for us. (We both ran/run a graphics business out of our house.) The movie also really played up the health care outside the US, profiling Canada, UK, FR & even Cuba. Was wondering if anyone on this board would be willing to chime in about how you feel about the health care in your country? Michael Moore did a great job proving that the "grass is greener on the other side of the fence".... |
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| I am very happy with our health care here in Canada....I don't even think about it, really.
Don is diabetic and is at the doctor's or specialists on a regular basis for bloodwork etc. No charge. Eye exams are free for him , too, every 6 months. The kids go for physicals every year. No charge. When we are sick, and want to see a doctor, or need any kind of medical care e.g. hospital, we just go. No charge. For example, we had a car accident last month, paramedics etc. came,. then we all went to the hosptial for check-ups. Don had about 30 x-rays of his neck and back. Even in a different provicne we just showed them our card and they billed our province. Any kind of councelling or mental health care, broken bones, birthing kids....whatever..No charge. We will not see a bill for any of it. Actually, I have no idea what any of that costs. Our work plans pay for the prescriptions, and upgraded hospital rooms, and glasses etc. Dental care is NOT covered, however, by a government plan, so we pay for that ourselves....But in our case our work plans cover most of that, too. |
| In our travels, Joan and I met a man in Fort St. John BC. He is performing a lube job on our motorhome. His lips were blue, even though it was summertime.
He was telling me how he was going to close his lube business because he needed to travel to Minnesota to have a procedure done, because the wait in Canada for the procedure was too long. He still needed to raise $5,000 to make the trip. Is that enough? |
Ron wrote: In our travels, Joan and I met a man in Fort St. John BC. He is performing a lube job on our motorhome. His lips were blue, even though it was summertime.
He was telling me how he was going to close his lube business because he needed to travel to Minnesota to have a procedure done, because the wait in Canada for the procedure was too long. He still needed to raise $5,000 to make the trip. Is that enough? But I'm wondering what the difference is between waiting for a procedure or just being flat out denied to have a procedure, because of some type of pre-exhisting condition, or an anonymous person in an office building just decides that it's not life threatening enough? The thing that bothered me the most in the movie, were all of the bonuses and incentives being offered to insurance workers to deny coverage to people, for whatever reason they could find. They did explore the myth/?/fact that with socialism medicine that you have to wait forever for treatment, but they found plenty of people (cancer patients, etc.) that were happy with the treatment that they received. That's why I am hoping people will chime in with their experiences, because I hear so much about financial hardships that people have to shell out in order to get treatment here in the US. It sure would be nice not to have to worry about losing your house every time you struggle to make that insurance payment. When we were trying to find another carrier for health insurance (since our rate went up so much) we had a very hard time finding anything under $1,000 a month. If they price goes up $200 a month every year, how could we ever afford to continue with it? We were even looking into no frills "catastrophic" coverage plans but we could only find plans for about $600 a month and it had all of these omissions, like if you got cancer, etc... If people get sick, especially catastrophically, how can they heal themselves psychologically if they are worrying about how they will pay for their illness? |
| I agree with you ... how can one recover when they are worrying about how in the world will they be able to afford it if they become sick
I think we have great medical and hospital coverage in Canada and as for the waiting .. I have never found I had to wait very long for any procedures such as cancer biopsy, eye surgery, kidney removal, thyroid removal . And at no cost to us. and hubbys health plan (he's retired now but still carries it )pays for upgraded hospital , medical , glasses, contacts and dental. |
| I haven't seen the movie, but.............
One thing I don't understand is: Why is the fee for the SAME service so much higher if you have no insurance, than it is if you do have insurance? We're paying for these fancy medical buildings with revolving doors. I know of one hospital that not only has a piano in one hall, they have a grand piano in the lobby. Of course it's roped off. We can pay for it, but we can't touch it! Enough with the fancy, we only need the basic's, good medical care, and modern equipment. Have you noticed when government gets involved in things, it is NOT for the betterment of the people, but rather, for the benefit of government? Have you checked out "the" great drug and health care plans for seniors? If not, you should. It will boil your blood! You almost need a degree just to figure it out! Government wants people to become dependent upon them. Insurance, taxes, medical expenses, gas, all of these things are driving people to the poor house. There are some easy solutions to these major problems. WE, the people, have the POWER to control big business, but instead, we continue to support them with our hard earned dollars. If we want change, WE have to make it happen. Yes, we may have to suffer some in the process, but the end result would be worth it for our kids and grandkids futures. jmop mouthypf |
| Health care I find in the US is very expensive. I have to pay for it my self and for only me its $300 a month, and its a horrible plan. I alone this year have spent over $2500 for medical care with Insurance(not including the $1600 in premiums I have paid) The dr.s cant seem to find out whats wrong with me, and I"m about to give up because I cant afford any more tests or procedures. One prescription alone for a 7 day supply was $246., because my insurance didn't want to cover it. They said it over too high of a dosage...............I'd rather wait than not be able to afford to see a doctor.... |
VerveUp wrote: Ron wrote: In our travels, Joan and I met a man in Fort St. John BC. He is performing a lube job on our motorhome. His lips were blue, even though it was summertime. He was telling me how he was going to close his lube business because he needed to travel to Minnesota to have a procedure done, because the wait in Canada for the procedure was too long. He still needed to raise $5,000 to make the trip. Is that enough? But I'm wondering what the difference is between waiting for a procedure or just being flat out denied to have a procedure, because of some type of pre-exhisting condition, or an anonymous person in an office building just decides that it's not life threatening enough? I'm not sure there is a whole lot of difference. From what my Canadian born patients tell me, the system works great for you average day to day health care needs or if you have a sudden life threatening illness. But for many things like MRI's, "elective" surgery or other non emergent needs it can be a nightmare of waiting. The up side seems to be healthcare for everyone, the down side the lengthy wait for many tests and procedures. I deal with insurance companies on a daily basis, and am appalled at the number of patients who often go untreated or receive substandard treatment because the insurance company is "managing" their care. Doug's sister died last year because it took the insurance company over 12 months to approved a much need bone marrow transplant. They considered it "expiramental" treatment. By the time it was approved she was too sick to recover. Michael Moore is my hero!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| Do not think for one minute that if you are a "cash" pay patient that you are not treated like a second class citizen. This country that is supposed to be the best in the world. Don't even get me started on the health care in this country. People with "good" health insurance are struggleing and losing their homes. It is rediculous. I'm going to close now, my shingles can't take the stress.
I do look forward to seeing the movie. |
Anonymous wrote: One thing I don't understand is:
Why is the fee for the SAME service so much higher if you have no insurance, than it is if you do have insurance? I haven't seen the movie either, because I think Michael Moore isn't credible. However, I do believe that our health care system is broken past repair. I agree with you mouthypf - why should a doctor be allowed to charge $500 for a procedure to an uninsured person, but negotiate that rate down to $80 for an insurance company? It's crazy. I'm also appalled at the amount of influence that the pharmaceutical companies have over treatment. Don't fix the underlying problem, just medicate it away. It's going to get worse soon. I've already received notice from my large corporate employer that our insurance options are being cut next year. Basically I'll have to choose an HMO or a high deductible policy with a self funded health care savings account. I have great insurance now, but they can take it away any time they want and force me to take a lower cost (to my employer) option. If my employer is doing it, I'll bet others will be doing it too. |
| Special incentive to check out the movie this weekend...
Michael Moore's web site wrote: [And, to show my thanks to all of you who'll go see "Sicko" this weekend, I'm going to send one of you and a guest on a free weekend to the universal health care country of your choice! That's right. You'll get to pick one of the three industrialized countries featured in the movie where, if you get sick, you get help for free, no matter who you are. All you have to do is send us your ticket stub (make sure it says "Sicko" on it and has the name of the theater and this weekend's date on it -- Friday, Saturday or Sunday - July 20th, 21st, 22nd). Attach the stub to a piece of paper with your name, address, phone number and email and send it to: 'Sicko' Night in America, 888c 8th Avenue, Suite 443, New York, NY 10019. (Yes, you have to use that old 18th century device called the U.S. Postal Service, and it has to be postmarked on or by Tuesday, July 24th). First prize is a weekend in the city of your choice: Paris, London or Toronto. This includes airfare, hotel, meals and, most exciting, a representative from their fine universal health care system who will give you a personal tour so you can see how they treat their fellow citizens. You'll meet people who pay nothing for college and citizens who are in the fourth week of their six-week paid vacation. Oh, and you'll have time to see the Eiffel Tower, Big Ben or whatever they have in Toronto that is old and tall. (If you don't have a passport, we'll pay for that, too!) |
| I have not seen the movie. However, I believe that I am more experienced than most about the cost of healthcare in this country.
After three years fighting colon cancer and with fairly good medical insurance, I have spent over $85,000 in UN-REIMBURSED co-payments simply because the medications are priced so high. As an example, because my blood cell count got too low during chemotherapy, I had to undergo Procrit injections. You may have seen them advertised on TV. Yes, they work as advertised but what isn't mentioned in the advertising is the fact that each injection is priced at $3,100 ! When I scheduled an appointment with my doctor for the injection as I was instructed by the hospital's scheduling office, I paid the full price. On the second injection, she (my doctor) asked me why I was coming to her when it would be easier to obtain the shots elsewhere. If I went to the hospital's emergency room and paid the $100 ER co-pay, the shot was free! Needless to say, I spent three days a week for the next six weeks commuting to the ER to save over $50,000 ! Noone seemed to have an explanation for why I was misled nor why I was not given a refund for the first $6,200 ... Sorry, but I felt the need to rant...I apologize to all I may have offended.  but the cost of medical care in the US is out of control and neither our elected officials nor the large drug companies seem to want to give up 'bleeding' folks dry.  |
| You want a "single payer" such as Medicaid to do it? Joan has spent the last 2 months trying to get some teeth pulled (literally) for an elderly woman on Medicaid. The teeth are rotting and causing discomfort and will need to be replaced by dentures. She still doesn't have approval from Medicaid for the extractions, never mind the dentures. Finding a dentist who would even accept Medicaid patients because of the hassles was nearly impossible. The wait is forever, though our personal dentist agreed to see her (as a favor to us) for her preliminary exam, the prerequisite for the approval process, 3 weeks ago. The woman is 93 and is now in a nursing home. Doesn't she deserve better than this?
'Zat who you want managing/rationing your healthcare? (She had to spend down to her last dollars her life's savings of $80,000 before Medicaid/Medicare would cover her nursing home, otherwise she would have paid for this herself. It's getting to the point where we may cover the expense and pray that Medicaid reimburses us.) *I* have the solution for the healthcare crisis. Wanna see? Let's talk about it. http://forum.oes.org/viewtopic.php?t=14973 |
| It makes me so sad to read about everyone's bad experiences. I hope things get better for everyone.
I won't see the movie because Michael Moore is cruel to animals...and I'm a stubborn animal rights activist. |
Lil Walty wrote: I won't see the movie because Michael Moore is cruel to animals...and I'm a stubborn animal rights activist.
How is he cruel to animals? Because he filmed an out of work family killing their own rabbits to eat for dinner or to sell the meat? That scene bothered me quite a bit, but unfortunately it is not against the law to kill and eat rabbits. I can't say that I'm a totally on the Michael Moore bandwagen, because at times I think he's very over the top, but I do think he shakes things up a bit in corporate America and I think that is a good thing. |
I think Michael Moore was best portrayed in Team America...
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VerveUp wrote: Special incentive to check out the movie this weekend...
Michael Moore's web site wrote: [ You'll get to pick one of the three industrialized countries featured in the movie where, if you get sick, you get help for free, no matter who you are. ...... a representative from their fine universal health care system who will give you a personal tour so you can see how they treat their fellow citizens. You'll meet people who pay nothing for college and citizens who are in the fourth week of their six-week paid vacation. If Michael Moore thinks this is such a crappy country he is welcome to move to one of those fine countries who he has described. No one here is stopping him. And since he is being so generous how about just showing his movie for a discount this weekend instead of encouraging people to rush out and see it over the three day weekend for a lottery shot at health care only so he can say his movie was the number one movie in the country on the convenient three days that they keep those statistics. Yes he is being compassionate all the way to the bank and he does a lot of complaining for someone who takes the ticket money from all of these people in financial/health straits. Before anyone gets in an uprise about this post I am not saying that there isn't a problem. I am saying that Michael Moore is not any better than the "crappy country" he loves to complain about in sticking it to you. And that seeing Michael Moore's movie does NOT solve the healthcare problem in this country - it just lines his pockets! |
| Didn't mean for this to become a Michael Moore thread, and maybe I fueled it by adding the ticket incentive from his web site.
Just wondering how other countries feel about their health care? |
| Because I live near a border town to Canada I hear quite often that Canadians come to the US for medical care. Apparently there are long waiting lists for many procedures and elective surgery is not paid for by the government. If this is true or not I don't know.
What I do know is since I'm self employed I pay my own health insurance, currently $1600.00 a month and going up in November. I'd love to switch companies but my husband has RA and high blood pressure that a new company , at best , would not cover for at least six months. I had cervical and spinal fusions done several years ago and no company would cover any claims related to that. Since I am now having problems with my neck again I'm stuck with what I have. Just the cost of an MRI and other tests that have to be done can be staggering. |
| Are you sure about the coverage thing?
I am POSITIVE that (at least here in Massachusetts) pre-existing conditions are not a consideration when you go from one employment based plan to another. As long as there has been continuous coverage. I don't know if that's a state thing or what. Can you (or have you already) call a few insurers and ask anonymously about individual plans? If the rules are the same for employment plan rolloevers, maybe it makes sense to get a job with a company that offers benefits, OR to start your own employment group. You're paying enough to cover a couple or 3 employees. |
All the carriers I've talked to have some kind of exclusion period for a pre existing condition . Most are for six months, which isn't too bad unless you need to use the insurance. My current coverage is 100%, no deductable. The company no longer writes this plan and the best I can find is an 80/20. The premium cost is not that much less than I'm paying now, at most a few hundred dollars a month. Now that I'm no longer a spring chicken  I'm afraid to change companies since I"ll probably start falling apart soon  |
violet wrote: Do not think for one minute that if you are a "cash" pay patient that you are not treated like a second class citizen. This country that is supposed to be the best in the world. Don't even get me started on the health care in this country. People with "good" health insurance are struggleing and losing their homes. It is rediculous. I'm going to close now, my shingles can't take the stress.
I do look forward to seeing the movie. I think it depends on your doctor. I have in incurable condition that I see an expensive specialist for. Last year I required surgery to the tune of $30,000. I have no health insurance; no one will insure me with my pre-existing condition. My doctor and his staff helped me get the bill for my hospital stay reduced to NOTHING. My doctor's office will match the hospital's reductions up to 30%. And I had a private room, and an overnight stay for what other doctors believe is an "out patient" procedure... for FREE. By the end of it all, my doctor and his staff got my bill from $30,000 down to $10,000. Still alot of money, but its considerably less than the original bill. I say chose your doctor VERY wisely; its took my 12 years of being sick to find this one.... he's a keeper! |
| You are very lucky. I am glad you where able to find a doctor like that. The sad facts are few are like that and few can afford to be so generous. My life with Shingles with/without health insurance has been an eye opener. My daughter's dealing with CMT is also an eye opener...I will eventually get well...she never will..so she is stuck in this crazy system for a long time.
One story I will tell you that happened to my daughter and then I won't expose her private business again (at least for now lol) My daughter has CMT and is disabled...she gets a check once a month, which her health insurance is taken out of. She has to pay co pays and deductables just like the rest of us with health insurance. Her income is less then $1,000 per month before the insurance is taken out. Her date to receive her money changes each month because it is the second Wed of the month. She is on pain meds which are government regulated...you can only fill them at certain times and she has to see her dr monthly. If she runs out, and the date of her check do not coenside with the dr appointment, she is in trouble. Now she has been a patient of this dr since he opened up his practice....she was his first patient. She has ALWAYS paid her bill when she was seen...they have never had a problem with her trying to get her pain meds early...they are familiar with her situation. So one day, her appointment was the day before her check...her co pay was $10....yes $10 which she would not have until the next day. The receptionist said they would not see her....so she had to drive all over to hunt my hubby down for the $10. So that she could see the dr so she could get her scrips. They only took cash at that time. Now my hubby also did Handyman work for them....and they ran an account with him. I was never so angry in my life. Don't be mad at Michael Moore because he shines a light on things that need changes here badly. As they say "don't shoot the messanger". Michael Moore has said many time that he loves this country that is why he is trying to make it a better place to live, as I am sure we all are. We are an extremely intelegent and creative group of people and will come up with a solution to the health care problem. Not everyone is going to be happy but it will be better then it is now. I have a lot of faith in our country to solve this problem. |
| oh, I completely agree that my situation is the exception to the rule. I went through 4 "average" docotrs before I found the one I have now. 10 years of poor treatment and not being able to afford medicines and procedures have taken my illness and amped it up to the point where my new doctor wants to use my case in the next book he writes, as it is so extreme. If I had found the right doctor 10 years ago, willing to help me the way this one has, I might not be such an extreme case. |
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