If a breeder is advertising online-what should be included?
I know we've been having a lot of discussions lately about breeders and I don't really want this thread to turn into that...but, what would one look for on a breeder website that would make you think they are reputable and want to look more closely at them? Would they have to include things like scans of hips and that sort of thing? Or could it be more general, just talking about their puppies and the mom or whatever and then they could have all the 'official' stuff at their home when you get there? |
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| Not everyone has a scanner.... to check hip certifications it's easy, just go to www.offa.org and type in the kennel name. It will list all their dogs. |
| I think she's just asking what traits (on their web site) would make you think that they're reputable. In other words, is this necessary information on a Web site that would make you consider this breeder as reputable. I would probably assume if someone has a Web site, they'd probably have a way of scanning something, too. |
| Yeah, what Jill said! I pretty much know what I should be looking for in puppies and breeders (I think!) from being on this forum so much, but I also hear a lot that most reputable breeders don't advertise, or especially don't advertise online.
And I guess it depends on each breeder's online capabilities, savvy, and general willingness to be online, but I was just curious to those more knowlegeable than I am, as to what 'should' be on a breeder's website... |
| More important would be the information you receive from the breeder, things like the pedigree of the parents, references from the breeder including buyers and their Vet. What kind of genetic testing do they do. Do they stand behind the health of their dog For Life.
On another forum I am on there was quite a discussion about whether reputable breeders "advertise" or not. Some seemed to feel that a good breeder should not advertise. I don't agree with that. Advertising is a tool used to promot a product. Ultimately it is the quality of the product you are interested in, no how it is promoted. |
| I don't know... I feel I am a responsible, ethical breeder, I've included a lot of info on my site, but my scanner is hosed so I don't have copies of my dogs hip certification on my site yet. I'd be willing and able to mail or fax a copy to people though.
I wouldn't sell a puppy online, my site is just there to be informative, and allow people to see photos of my dogs. It's also a good place for me to post my showing experiences and photos etc. If anyone contacts me about puppies through my website I answer the email and provide my phone number. I want to actually talk to them, get a feel for them... and preferably meet them in person. I think reputable breeders having websites and advertising more online in general is a good thing. Many breeders don't like it and haven't/won't do it, but it is my opinion that people looking for a pup ARE going to use the internet, and if all they find are puppy mills and byb's off sites like puppyfind, then how will they know the difference? If I were looking for a pup what I would want to see on a website is an indication that the people show, information about the breed so people have an idea of what they're getting into before they start, photos of dogs so that I can see visually they are quality dogs, and just a general feeling that they know what they're doing and care about it deeply. I'm not really sure what else I would be looking for, but I do know that I can almost instantly tell by a website if I wouldn't want a pup from them. |
| I definitely don't think "advertising" with a website should be a mark against a breeder. Being technologically savvy or having a child/friend/family member who is technologically savvy doesn't mean you are a bad breeder.
Also...I guess it doesn't really matter what is on the website...because if you are truely looking for a good breeder you will double check all of their references, the vet they use and not just rely on what they have posted. Unfortunately too many people take what is offered on any website (dog related or not) as the honest truth and don't take the time to check the facts. I suppose the more concrete information they have the "better" they look. If the website is primarily pictures and fun stories it doesn't really tell you anything about their lines. |
| Personally, I look for words like....
show stud champion home-raised Then I like to read "puppies to selected homes for show or companion" or "available to qualified homes" (that one's from Blueshire!) near the end. Ideally, I'd like to get the impression that selling puppies is not their primary focus, and I'd also like to get the impression that I will need to impress the breeder and pass their interview to be approved to have one of their puppies. I'd look for someone who won't sell a puppy to anyone with the $$$. |
| Because on the website I was looking at this morning I initially had the reaction of these people are hobby breeders (I don't want to call them backyard breeders because it doesn't appear that they are doing this often or for a living)...and they didn't have anything of substance on their site...Just nice stories and cute pictures and them saying their dogs are healthy, etc.
So to me, it pops out as 'non-reputable' but then I was thinking, well, maybe they just didn't put the good information online for whatever reason. I am 99% sure they aren't reputable, but it just made me wonder what a website would have to include to make me think, Oh, these people are reputable! (Like Stacey's website). |
| I look for stuff about the testing of the breeding stock, and announces of shows recently won, clubs they belong to, and what type of links they have. I like to see some details on their contract, including spay/neuter conditions and guarentees...also the age they let the pups leave. Some information on their breeding program is nice.
A breeder can be someone like you or me, have a simple website and still be reputable. Nothing qwrong with hobby breeders, in fact most fo the good ones are....it is the commercial breeders that I stay away from. I would "encourage" breeders like Stacey to advertise pups online IF there are any left over from the watiing lists. Then potential purchasers would not only have the BYB's to review online. I also like to see pups go to their new homes as soon as possible after 8-10 weeks, so they can bond appropriately with their new families. I don't think a breeder hanging onto a pet puppy for months hoping that someon will find them is in the best interest of the dog....mabye the breeder, but not the pup. What I see as a BYB, surprisingly enough, is when they only have a couple of dogs and they are both the parents. Shows me that they are not trying to improve the breed, but just making the same pups over and over, and selling them. In any case I would never buy a pup from anyone without either going to see the place myself, and reviewing the health test results, or having someone I know and trust go...if too far. The words "Happy and healthy puppies...vet checks, first shots etc "mean nothing to me. |
Willowsprite wrote: Not everyone has a scanner.... to check hip certifications it's easy, just go to www.offa.org and type in the kennel name. It will list all their dogs.
Is this site for Canadian Kennels as well? |
| No it's not, however a few Canadian kennels OFA some of their dogs. Usually a male who is being heavily campaigned at American shows will be OFA'd.
Canadians certify through OVC (Ontario Veterinary College), and they do not have an online database. I *think* anyone can call them and ask about a particular dog, but I'm not sure. Either way, the owner of the dog should have a certificate that they can show people. |
| I agree with Bosley's mom.... the BEST way to check out a breeder is to visit them in person. Meet their dogs, see where they live. I know it's unpractical for some (like those in Nova Scotia), but I would never buy a puppy without visiting the breeder's home/kennel first. |
| Just because they don't have show dogs, and champion lines doesn't make them bad breeders. If you are just curious, or if you are really looking for another pup, give them a call and go from there.
You could also just tell us the web address or their names, and who knows, they might be known by some of the members. I found my little girl from a web site, and I don't believe they had anything listed as far as testing. When I spoke with the breeder, both the mother and father had been tested. |
| You could START by looking here:
http://dmoz.org/Recreation/Pets/Dogs/Br ... /Breeders/ This section is for hobbyist breeders (essentially those trying to improve the breed). Breeders have to meet a particluar standard before they can be listed here as opposed to being in a more "commercial" category. Things to look for are full pedigrees, show pictures, kennel history, no paying for puppies over the web, no promises of puppies for payment, etc. Quote: Recreational categories are intended for the hobbyist with a focus on the breed and showing the animals; on limited occasions litters or puppies may become available and offered to the public. Websites whose primary focus is to sell puppies or dogs will be considered a business. Currently all businesses selling puppies or dogs as companions, pets, or show animals should be listed in Regional under the businesses physical location
It isn't perfect, but it's a place to start. I know that the editors are always looking for helpful suggestions with site inclusions for --and exclusions from-- those breeder lists. |
| I just saw a really impressive website - these people are farmers who breed both cattle and mini australian shepherds. She's opening a retail dog store in my area which is how I found her website. I loved this disclaimer (see below) - sounds very much like the kind of warning that OES breeders should give! She's definitely trying to warn off the impulse buyers. It's obvious from her site that she's dedicated to her breed and particular about who she'll place her puppies with.
*** Before considering a Mini Aussie please take the time to answer the following questions and check out the different links we have provided to get a better understanding of the breed. CAN YOU: KEEP YOUR AUSSIE BUSY ENOUGH TO STAY OUT OF TROUBLE? AUSSIES ARE VERY INTELLIGENT AND MAY FIND WAYS TO ENTERTAIN AND EXERCISE THEMSELVES IF YOU DON''T. BARKING, CHEWING, DIGGING AND ESCAPING ARE ALL POSSIBILITIES. MANAGE A DOG THAT HAS STRONG GUARDIAN INSTINCTS AND IS POSSIBLY RESERVED WITH STRANGERS? HANDLE A DOG THAT MAY CHASE AND HERD LIVESTOCK, AND PEOPLE IF NOT PROPERLY TRAINED? STAND HAVING A CONSTANT COMPANION AS THEY ARE VERY DEVOTED? TRAIN YOUR PUPPY FROM THE DAY IT ARRIVES HOME TO TRAIN AN UNRULY PUPPY INTO A WELL MANNERED COMPANION? COMMIT TO DAILY EXERCISE SUCH AS WALKS, THROWING A BALL OR FRISBEE FOR AN HOUR OR SO ? TEACH YOUR PUPPY NOT TO CHASE CHILDREN AND NIP AT HEELS? SOME BECOME OVER STIMULATED BY THE NOISE AND ACTIVITY. PROPERLY SOCIALIZE YOUR PUPPY FROM A YOUNG AGE? GROOM YOUR PUPPY REGULARLY AS THEY WILL SHED? |
| I think it is wonderful when breeders have educational informative web sites. I believe there is a HUGE difference between having and maintaining a web site for your kennel and "advertising" on line.
Many of the well know maltese breeders have excellent web sites which include pages and pages of educational information on grooming etc. They may also have a section on "puppies available" which some may consider advertising but I see nothing wrong with it. |
| ^^^^^^^^
yes! 10 times better than 98% of the oes sites i've been to! very detailed grooming, care, & health sections |
| I have been lurking on this forum for a while and I must say that eveyone has good advise and suggestions for every question and situation posed.
I have to agree with Willowsprite (and everyone else) wholeheartly, when they suggest that there must be some kind of evaluation done, but I wanted to add some additional information. Not everyone in Canada uses the Ontario Veterinary College (OVC) to certify their dogs. There are a lot of Canadian dogs that are certified at the Western College of Veterinary Medicine in Saskatoon, Saskatchewan. But no matter where the xrays are done, to get an "OFA Certification" the xrays must be sent to the OFA for evaluation, and once evaluated the OFA rates them according to the OFA scale (good, fair excellent, etc) then the dogs registered name and evaluation is listed on the OFA website. Dr. Phar, does the evaluation of xrays done at WCVM used to work for the OFA about 15 years ago. I know that the OVC has an evaluator with equal experience and expertise in xray evaluation. But I feel that the OFA is still the best evaluation no matter if the dog is from Canada or the USA. All of my sheepdogs both males and females have had OFA numbers before they were bred. None of my dogs were ever campaigned, only shown to their Canadian and sometimes and Americian Championships. Thanks |
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